#206 - Reprogramming your mind for noise relief.

Unknown Speaker [0:01]: Welcome to the Misophonia podcast. This is episode 206. My name's Adeel Ahmad, and I have Misophonia. This is a cool episode because I have two guests, Tressie and Brooklyn. Brooklyn, you may know as Brooklyn Dish, who is a misophonia coach and has all kinds of resources on her website, brooklyndish.com. And there's a link in the show notes. Tressie has worked with Brooklyn and has also published a book of her own, which is a fictionalization. of many of her experiences living with misophonia. Both guests discussed the challenges they faced growing up, the lack of understanding and resources available, and how they eventually connected through a shared Facebook group. They talk about misophonia as not a defect, but a trait that can be managed through various strategies. including reprogramming the mind and fostering connections with others who share similar experiences. Both of them have seen their misophonia greatly, greatly reduced. We also touch on the skepticism surrounding alternative therapies. They discussed the role of meditation as well and the impact of childhood experiences and the importance of understanding and advocating for misophonia as a distinct condition. After the show, let me know what you think. You can reach out by email at hello at misophoniapodcast.com or hit me up on Instagram or Facebook at Misophonia Podcast. By the way, please head over, leave a quick rating or review wherever you listen to the show. It really helps drive us up in those algorithms. A few announcements. This podcast just hit five years. We started five years ago, and I just want to remind folks that anyone can sign up to be a guest. Just head to misophoniapodcast.com and click the Be A Guest link. Misophonia.shop is open. I recently relaunched the merch shop where you can find shirts, hats, AirPods, cases, and lots of things related to the podcast. It's just getting started, so watch that space for a lot more. All profits go to support this podcast. The recording and hosting fees, 5% also goes to support. research by So Quiet, and the rest goes towards some special projects, which I'll be talking about soon. And also, of course, thanks for the incredible ongoing support of our Patreon supporters. You can contribute by heading to patreon.com slash misophonia podcast. All right, without further ado, here's my conversation with Tressie and Brooklyn. Okay, well, very exciting. Tressie and Brooklyn, thanks for coming on the podcast. Great to have you here. good to be here thanks for having me so yeah these um two people or three people podcasts that kind of go back and forth maybe i'll just randomly start with with tressie because i think you reached out first um do you want to tell us a little bit about where you know roughly where you're located and kind of what you do and then we'll get obviously get into the details and stuff later

Brooklyn [3:07]: Sure. So I actually am in North Dakota right now. I've spent some real time in Wyoming as well, but I'm spending time with family and was finishing up my books and getting them published and looking forward to putting them out there for others to read.

Unknown Speaker [3:25]: Awesome. Yeah, I'm excited to hear about those. And Brooklyn, for anyone who doesn't know you, tell us a little bit about yourself.

Brooklyn [3:34]: yeah so as you said i'm brooklyn that's the obvious part i am in fort wayne indiana so northeast indiana a couple hours north of indy not that you need that specific information but that's where i'm at and i am a coach for people who experience misophonia which is something that i struggled with for about 20 years

Unknown Speaker [3:55]: Awesome. Yeah, I would love to hear about that as well. But yeah, maybe, Tressie, I would love to get to the book, but maybe people would love to hear the backstory. When did you first start experiencing misophonia? Tell us kind of how you got to this place.

Brooklyn [4:14]: Okay. You know, I do remember being... at our beautiful, well-set dining room table with a very hearty home-cooked meal that my mother would make and have all of us participate in maybe prepping a little bit, but more so setting the table and just being family and coming together. And it's supposed to be such a wonderful time where you pray together and blessing your meal and blessing one another and being thankful for everything that you've been given and then enjoy this fine-cooked meal. and um i just i didn't understand what was happening to me at that time it was really really confusing but i i was nine the earliest memory you know was me feeling like I had all this boiling anger just coming up inside of me. And I would just spew at family for making mouth noises and scraping their teeth and just all kinds of things. And I didn't understand it. And I would be in a fit of tears and so distraught and angry. And I mean, I was a sweet, quiet person. shy little gal. And so I was confused why this would even happen to me either. And I thought it was pretty awful. So I spent a lot of time having meals in the bathroom in mornings because I would be getting ready. And I think my family just learned to bring me my meal and I would just get ready in front of the mirror in my bathroom just to have quiet, peaceful time and deal with whatever that was I was going through.

Unknown Speaker [5:56]: yeah so it seems like they accommodated a little bit or at least what was it kind of their reaction other than other than um you know giving you the food in the bathroom or whatever did they was there fights or was it just yes there was i mean i i grew up with two brothers i was a middle child and i was close in age with my oldest and i mean he didn't know and siblings have rivalries and you know

Brooklyn [6:20]: people just don't understand. And I didn't know what was going on. And my folks certainly didn't know either. But they were just trying to, you know, squelch anything that might be less than appropriate. And so I think a lot of times I got squelched. But it was not anything that I understood or they understood to the point that we would know. I lived my life just kind of going around the outer edges of things socially because I was so triggered by so much. And, you know, gum chewing and popping was the biggest one. And popcorn. I mean, just all the things that I've read about and listened to on the other podcasts. And, you know, I just didn't know. It didn't make me feel good. But by the time I was... In my 30s, and I had, you know, I decided to get a master's degree. I really searched. I researched so much over the years, but really did during graduate school, trying to find what my condition was called. I was probably one of the less than fortunate who never really learned what my condition was called until... I was about 47, I think. And I was at a basketball game where I was being a parent and doing what all parents do at a basketball game, watching your kids and trying to enjoy that. And the auditorium was just miserable. And, you know, the quiet hallways or quieter hallways were easier. But then that's also where everybody ate and chewed and popped gum. And I had another mom, basketball mom, kind of get upset with the boy. On the team, I think it might have even been her own son for popping his gum or something like that. And that's when I first learned that somebody else really was driven batty by that. I mean, to a degree that I completely understood without her saying that this, whatever this was, was not just me. I don't know. It was just an understanding. But she said, you know, there's a name for this. I'll let you know. And she did send me a text sometime later and told me, but that was the first I'd learned about it. But I really kind of struggled with, um, with my health for a little bit with thyroid disease, Hashimoto's fluctuating, um, results between hypo and hyper thyroidism, which is Hashimoto's. And I've had that since I was 27. So, you know, I don't know too many years to count anyway. Um, I just didn't feel well and everything was heightened. And so was this sensitivity to noise and mouth noises. And so I really struggled and I more or less took myself out of my element, gave myself some time away to try to figure out what was wrong with me. Did quite a bit of research. I mean, I always researched. I've always been a researcher. I've always been a journaler and a writer. But I just really needed to find out what was wrong with me. I didn't do that right away because I really, truly started to shut down. I didn't feel well, and it took a while. Anyway, I had always wanted to write a book, and I think that Divine Intervention played a part, and it ended up being a book about many things, but Misavonia was the driving force. And I'm... I'm satisfied and very proud of the book I've written, Guided by Trudent North, Navigating Life's Journey with Misophonia. I did fictionalize it. There's a lot of truth in there as well. But I also wanted to give myself something that I wish there had been when I was a nine-year-old girl grappling with this, and we didn't know what it was, and I struggled at school. When I was in school, I didn't tell anybody. I just closed down.

Unknown Speaker [10:29]: Yeah, I was going to ask, did you talk to anybody or even without knowing the name?

Brooklyn [10:33]: Yeah, gotcha. No, never. We took state tests and I would just... I would just crawl into my turtle shell. As a matter of fact, I was that kid that just went through and I just colored in all of the circles. And I'm sure that when my parents went to parent-teacher conferences that they were being told that I was academically something less than what I was. I knew that I had intelligence. I just truly could not stand the swish of pants, or actually I went to a Catholic school, of dresses or the boys' slacks. um pencil sharpening um I mean it just it went from snack time to all of those extra things bags you know it just so I shut down so I I really looking back thought man I wish that there had been school counselors at that time that I had somebody that I could have gone and talked to you know I'm a school counselor that's what I did in my professional working life and um I wish that there had been someone like me that I could have talked to. There wasn't. I didn't know how to express myself. I just clammed up and went into my shell. And I really was never showing success in the manner that I could have if. Probably I would have talked more about what was going on or my parents would have known more. But, you know, they did lots of great things for me. I'm not condemning what they didn't do so much as want to give praise to them for all the things that they did right. But misophonia. was crippling for me. And I certainly didn't want to lash out at school. But, you know, probably way back then started some of that inner turmoil and that negative self-talk that just went on for a lifetime. And I never wanted to be that ever. And so when that started to come back after decades of my adulthood of realizing that I had worked on that in every way that I could from childhood being nurtured to be positive, to doing positive things with people, or being kind and being a good Christian, to educating myself in those areas, and even going through to be a school counselor to help others. And just being the nurturing person I am, I just realized when my health failed that endometriosis had taken over and made me so miserable that... I needed to do something. I was low. It was bad. It had affected the trajectory of my life. And I can't say that that was for the first time. But it definitely changed the trajectory of my life in a big way with my family. It separated me from my family.

Unknown Speaker [13:16]: Your immediate family or your... Yes.

Brooklyn [13:20]: Everybody, really. I ran. I ran.

Unknown Speaker [13:23]: Yay.

Brooklyn [13:25]: I really didn't know for sure what all was going on with me. And I thought misophonia might be something even more serious than what it is. Honestly, this is doable. I can do this. But I wondered if... At the core of me, I thought something fundamentally... was extremely wrong with me, even more than what misophonia is. And I didn't want a misdiagnosis. I wanted to know truly what was my issue. So I researched.

Unknown Speaker [13:59]: And where did that let you? Sounds like it led you to Brooklyn.

Brooklyn [14:02]: It led me to Brooklyn.

Unknown Speaker [14:03]: Yeah. And there's other stuff I want to ask about your past, but I also don't want to like, yeah, miss this opportunity now that you're both here is to talk about kind of like, how did you, how did you connect? And maybe we'll kind of walk through some of the things you guys did together. And then we can, we can also hear about Brooklyn's background.

Brooklyn [14:23]: Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Well, I can, do you want me to share how we connected? Yes, please do. Because I, I think you can help round that out. Okay. So I guess, okay. I can give like a little background of my experience with misophonia and that will lead me to how I connected with Tressie. So it all kind of goes together. But Tressie and I have a lot of similarities in our stories. It's, it's kind of amazing that we did connect and that she was one of the first people that ever trusted me to, to help her with her misophonia, which I'll, I'll get to that later. But we do have a lot of, similarities like for me it started who knows when it actually started my experience with misophonia I don't have a great memory from childhood like anything before 19 I feel like is like gone except for like some things here and there but I do know that was probably around the age of like seven and I think one of the first things that people noticed was the like certain noises that people would make when singing in the car. I would like be asked, like, can you stop singing? Can you stop doing that? And my family was like, well, you can sing. Why is that not a problem? And we can't do it. I didn't have an answer for it. I was so young. And I actually just met with my grandma for lunch a couple of days ago. And she reminded me that apparently when I was like seven or nine years old, my sister would be playing music in her room. And there was like a whole closet in between our rooms, but it would still drive me absolutely nuts. And I would get so, so angry. So to hear that from her was interesting as well. And again, also the dinner table was a huge issue, like just because we used to eat together as a family and that ended pretty quickly, at least for me after this kind of set in. but misophonia really was like trustee said it was incredibly debilitating for me as well like it's a miracle i think that i'm alive and here today it was especially really challenging during high school really really challenging during college like getting my bachelor's degree was like the coolest thing ever because i thought i was gonna have to drop out so it was it was very debilitating and even when i was growing up in the 90s early 2000s i was born in 96 there weren't really many resources and at the time it was still called selective sound sensitivity syndrome which is an interesting name for people who are like sensitive to sound to have all those s's in there right i didn't think about that but yes yeah and so i didn't even find out it was called misophonia until until much later but skipping skipping ahead a little bit so obviously i did a ton of work to to what i call eliminate it i can talk about that later what that means for myself and then i thought okay this is really amazing if i can do this for myself can i help other people so kind of what tressie said i wanted to offer what wasn't there when i was struggling and so i actually went into a facebook group that i think we're all a part of and i basically was like hey does anyone want to work with me like i tried these things and i'm so much better like my testimony is gone this is amazing does anyone want to work with me The response was not ideal. There was a lot of skepticism, a lot of world, you know, you know, yes, absolutely. People were like, this isn't like this must be some kind of scam. Who are you to offer like all the things which I get because especially if you experience misophonia, you've likely tried a lot of things that haven't worked. So I did on one hand understand it. And on the other hand, I was like, I really just want to help people. And it was really difficult. Like I went offline for like two weeks. I took all of my stuff down. I was basically hiding. And I had a couple people, Tressie being one of them, who reached out to me and was like, hey, I'm willing to work with you. And that trust was like, I did not take that for granted. So she was truly one of the first people to ever work with me. And she is the reason that I have been able to continue doing this work to get better, to be more confident in helping people. So it was really through a Facebook group is how we first connected. Very long story short.

Unknown Speaker [18:32]: Yeah, no, I mean, people crap on Facebook, but when the stories like this happen, I think that that makes it all worthwhile. Um, yeah, there's some, there's some big Facebook groups and, and yeah, like some of us who are ranty that it's hard to, it's hard to keep track of what's going on, but, um, it's, that's great. Little, uh, golden nuggets kind of happened. So, um, so, so yeah, you, okay. You, you met and, um, you were kind of reinvigorated. Um, what did you, what did you do next? Did you, did you, you were coming back from your little, um, detox i'll call it but like did you come up with a new like new plan uh new kind of curriculum and and how did that how did that work and was it successful sounds like there was some success so that is that is also a good question so what i have now i approach like misophonia relief now in like three phases or i call it three keys to misophonia relief i like metaphors

Brooklyn [19:24]: But that system was developed through working with people one-on-one first. So again, Tressie was a big part of helping me figure out, okay, I can do this for you one-on-one, but I only have so much time. I'm only one person. So if I want to help as many people as possible, yes, I can work with people one-on-one, but can I also put this into something where I can help multiple people at a time? So I have the program that I have now. And a big part of that was developed through my own experience and working with one-on-one clients early on. But meeting with Tressie, it was a lot of just unconscious reprogramming. So I feel like I'm skipping over a lot, like how I think of this.

Unknown Speaker [20:03]: Yeah, I'll remember some of these terms because, yeah, I mean, right. Because you're talking about some stuff that I think we've talked about with some common friends in terms of like reprogramming memories and then maybe talking about where that comes from. So, yeah, we'll move around. Don't worry. Just go natural.

Brooklyn [20:22]: Well, yeah, I would say it's a lot of just so how I see misophonia is I don't even really believe that you need a cure per se. I know a lot of people are like scared of the word cure. But personally, I don't when I work with clients, the first thing that I like to establish is that there really isn't anything wrong with you or me or anyone else who experiences it. As human beings, we all have. patterns and programmings and some of them are really useful and some of them aren't and so it's just a pattern that your mind has developed is how i see it so that's where the unconscious reprogramming comes in is how can we change the relationship that your mind has with these noises And that's for me, it starts with actually like the first key, I call it is like shifting your perspective. So actually helping people see or believe that change is possible, because if you've already decided for yourself that there's nothing you can do and you're stuck with it forever, then there's nothing you can do and you're stuck with it forever. It's like a self-fulfilling prophecy. So that's the first thing that I work on is kind of changing that belief system. And then we go into the actual rewiring work. So kind of reprogramming the meaning that your mind has attached to the noises. And then we kind of wrap up with how can we process and navigate the really strong emotions that accompany misophonia in a way that's more useful. So that was a lot of the work that I did with Tressie, with other one-on-one clients. And that's what I do with people today too.

Unknown Speaker [21:52]: Gotcha. Okay. Yeah. So, um, yeah, when he said, uh, a number of those, those steps, um, yeah, first of all, instilling that, yeah, you can do something. Um, and then changing the, maybe trying to change the meaning behind what you're, um, what you're how you're interpreting the sounds i guess are these um some of these sounds kind of sound kind of like overlap a little bit with like cbt in terms of like changing your perspective on um the sounds that you're listening to um are these skills that you that you do in the moment every time that you're hearing triggers or is it something that over time kind of like you don't have to do and it's kind of like instinctual and and suddenly misophonia is not a thing so i'm kind of curious because sometimes when people hear about these kinds of skills they're thinking oh do i have to like stop and think about these skills every time or has it really kind of um is it part of the you know is is the name reprogramming really what's happening here and in in your in your view

Brooklyn [22:55]: That is also a really good question. So I would also be curious to hear Tressie's answer to this because we've worked together. So I'd be curious to hear how she approaches it now. For me in the beginning, there were some intentional steps. So if we want to change something, like I see misophonia as operating in the unconscious mind and then we experience it consciously at the conscious level. So if we want to change something that's happening unconsciously first, it helps to be aware of it. Like, how are you going to change something if you don't even know what's happening? So I think at first it can take some intentional effort. And some of the strategies and techniques that I do with people, they are intentional in the moment. And also, as you continue to build that new neural pathway, it almost starts to become second nature. So for me, if I hear a noise, because people ask me, like, are you not bothered by anything? Well, no. Most people who don't experience misophonia, there are still noises that bother them from time to time. So there are still some noises that annoy me, but it's not invoking. rage anxiety right it's more just like oh that's kind of annoying so there are some noises where maybe i will intentionally use a technique or a strategy that i know works but a lot of times it's it's become second nature like i'm not noticing those sounds anymore or i notice them but they just it's just a sound but i'd be curious to hear tressie's answer to that as well yeah

Brooklyn [24:26]: I'm going to go back to when I was young and I remember when the noises bothered me. I would find myself kind of spacing out and looking out the window or just really trying to remove myself from where I was at. Or I would count. I would count things like crazy. Yeah, that was a thing. And I would count forwards and I would count backwards. And when Brooklyn came up with some strategies, One of them was a counting trick. And I thought, sounds familiar. Anyway, obviously I'm not the child that I was then, and now I've had hypnotherapy and rapid response therapy and NLP and lots of other things to try to lessen what's... what my response or my reactive response was. I feel as though I went into this very open-minded. I wanted something. I just wanted it to lessen. I didn't want it to be so intense. I mean, on a scale of zero to 10, 10 is pretty intense. It can make you downright miserable. And that I was, um, So I'm a two, and I'm a two because of the RT, the NLP, and the hypnosis, and all of that, and meditation. But I would give major, major credit to meditation. I meditate morning and night, and I have, if need be, done that for myself during the day. I feel like... I feel like those neural pathways from the modalities that Brooklyn has used for me have really created a different sense within me with those neural pathways. And I feel like even when I hear the sounds that triggered me the most, the intensity is so not there. It is so low. It's that two on that scale. And it's just an awareness. So, um, just this week I've had to, um, kill someone no i don't want to kill her i absolutely love my mom i adore her i never had a sister my mom is it and all my adopted daughters that i adopt everywhere i go but anyway including brooklyn but anyway she gives me a thumbs up um she accepts the role anyway i I just, my mom flirts tea and it used to send me through the roof. She's not doing anything wrong. She's enjoying her tea or her coffee. And honestly, I can just say, I heard that and I can turn around and I can walk elsewhere, but it doesn't have the same effect. I just, I just have an awareness. Do I like it? No. But do I have to kind of back tread and say to myself, that doesn't hurt. It doesn't hurt me. It doesn't make me want to run. But I'm not going to lie. Old habits do die hard. And that's been the hardest thing for me at times is... I'm used to walking off. That particular trigger you're talking about.

Unknown Speaker [27:41]: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Brooklyn [27:43]: The T-circuit. And then another one was just my son had gum the other day. I never took gum away from my kids or popcorn or the things that bothered me. I just explained to them when I didn't know how much they bothered me, and please enjoy them, but do it away from me. Because I understood that that's just... People chew gum. They pop bubbles. They have that. I just asked if they didn't. But anyway, I was helping him with a computer project last night, and he had gum, and I did. I heard it.

Unknown Speaker [28:19]: How did you feel then? You didn't have to run or reach into his throat?

Brooklyn [28:23]: I didn't, but it does give me pause. Reach into his throat. Did not reach into his throat. I love that kid with my whole heart. I would never want to reach into his throat. But I hear you. I might have wanted to to my brothers back in the day.

Unknown Speaker [28:37]: Right, right. But that's a big change. I mean, that's a big shift.

Brooklyn [28:41]: It is a big shift. So I honestly really just had to focus... on what it meant and did it mean anything and it didn't and so all is well with my mom i actually had a conversation about it afterwards and it's not to make her feel bad but just because i know i can openly talk to her about how it was and how much better it is But to say it's cured, it's not cured. But what it is, is it's a two when it used to be a 10. That is huge. That's an improvement in life. It's not debilitating anymore. I'm just grateful. I'm just grateful. And I wanted to say, and I never finished that before, I just want to say really quick, when I first met Brooklyn... I told her that I was looking at writing a book. And I ended up writing, too. I wrote the children's book also. And that was for early childhood awareness. You know, The Cousin's Challenge, Overcoming Obstacles Together is my children's book. And it's a book that I would have loved to have been out there for me, for Brooklyn, for any other misophone that may just need some kind of acknowledgement. For you, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to exclude you. Not at all. For you. I know. I love it. But as a school or a school teacher and school counselor, you know, I was all about reading about special needs of individuals. I wanted there just to be acceptance for diversity. And so anyway, super excited about that book being written too. And probably we'll write more about it to explain more. That's probably just barely touching it, but yeah, crazy as it is, Brooklyn's my main character. And yes, it's a tribute to Brooklyn. Absolutely. But like I told her when I first met her, how beautiful her name was. I never had a daughter. It's okay that I didn't have a daughter. I have two great sons, love to pieces. But if I'd had a daughter, her name would have been Brooklyn. Now, how ironic is that? that Brooklyn is the practitioner coach that helped me with my misophonia. So anyway, there's meaning in that for me, and I love it.

Unknown Speaker [31:01]: Maybe positive karma. For sure. I wanted to share that. That's great. Actually, I also want to share something that I think Brooklyn and you said. Yeah, I don't agree. I don't think either that it's some medical defect that we must stop. snip the wire or something. It's a trait. Our brain has developed it for potentially a protective reason growing up. It's something that we don't necessarily need anymore. Are we going to go from 10 to 0 because we've taken a pill or something? I don't think that that's... the path that um it's kind of the better best pass i don't think that's the best path forward and i also think trying to think of it as terms of something that you just want to can shut off right away um takes you away from all these possible other learnings about other aspects of your life So which is a whole other dimension of I think one thing you mentioned a bunch of acronyms, the SRT, RRT, and we'll get to hypnosis later, too, because that's also a hot topic. But I'm just kind of curious, Brooklyn, you were talking about the different ways to interpret sound, but how does that relate to those modalities that Trusty was saying? And were there some modalities that worked more than others, or is it a soup that you kind of draw ideas from? I'm just kind of curious how those modalities worked in your, maybe starting just kind of in your experience together.

Brooklyn [32:33]: Mm-hmm. Do you want me to start or do you want to start? You can go right ahead. So I, like you said, it is kind of like a soup. That's an interesting way to describe it. It's kind of an ironic way. Yes, but I think it works. So if I'm working with someone... I will obviously in the program is more generalized, but if I'm working one on one with someone, I am pulling from what's going to make the most sense. So if I'm meeting with someone, they're going to be guiding that session. So I have like those three keys or those three steps, but I'm really listening to what they're saying and they're going to guide the session. So I might be pulling from NLP or neurolinguistic programming. I might be pulling from RRT or rapid resolution therapy. Or I don't typically do just like straight hypnosis sessions with clients. I have done that interesting. I did do that. But typically what I'm doing is I'm using hypnotic language patterns in those conversations. So if I'm meeting with a client, a session really just looks like a conversation with them. But we're using those modalities to engage the unconscious mind as well as the conscious mind, because just trying to logic or reason your way out of misophonia. like if that worked then none of us would have it like it would be gone we could just clear it and it wouldn't be an issue so that's why using some of those language patterns i use a lot of stories i use a lot of metaphors like sometimes when i'm talking with clients i'm like this is going to sound weird but just stay with me like i have a story about having a fist fight with a praying mantis at work one time but like it all ties in because we're engaging the unconscious mind as well. So that actually responds to the message that we're trying to get to it, which is, hey, these noises aren't actually a threat because we can just yell that we can scream it all day long. But the unconscious mind, it's like speaking a different language. It's like if consciously we're speaking English and the subconscious mind is speaking Russian, like it's not understanding it. So that unconscious reprogramming using the NLP, the RRT hypnotherapy, it can be that translation device. So we can get the good news of like, hey, these things aren't actually dangerous. We can get that to the mind in a way that it understands. So I do kind of pull from different things as I'm working with people. Does that kind of answer the question that you had?

Unknown Speaker [34:49]: Yeah, yeah, I'm curious. You mentioned that you're using metaphors and all. So are these conversations mainly you speaking in kind of a telling some story or speaking in kind of like a hypnosis script kind of thing? Is there a common theme that you're drawing from all of these? Or are there specific things that you're saying that maybe come from each of these? Or a specific message that you find has resonated a lot from each of these?

Brooklyn [35:17]: That is also a good question. So kind of yes and no to both of those. So like if we were having a session, it would start off maybe similar to how this podcast did. Like I would ask them, you know, tell me about your experience with misophonia. And then we might dive into starting with that first key. Like let's shift your perspective and get you to a place where you actually believe that healing from this is possible. And then we can go into the other work. So sometimes it is me like telling a story. Sometimes I'll have them close their eyes and imagine different things. If they're not visual, we'll call in other senses like sound and touch and taste and those kind of things. Other times it's just me asking them questions. I ask a lot of questions and I often have to say to clients, I promise this isn't a trick question. Just answer this however it makes sense. Because I'm kind of getting... an idea of their map of the world, because I don't want to push my views and experience of misophonia onto them. I think that builds a lot of trust because they don't have to waste time validating their experience to me because I've experienced it. But the way that I see it is going to be different from the way that they see it and experience it. So a lot of it is just understanding how are they operating in the world with misophonia and what's going to resonate for them to shift that. So an example of like a story that I would use is. if i am trying to get someone or to help them understand that change is possible that this is just a pattern and we can reprogram patterns that we don't like i'll talk about i'll ask them is there do you drive to work every day and if you do do you take the same route every day that's a pattern that your mind has built so that you don't have to think about every single turn every single road that you have to take you just know like you could be half asleep and drive yourself to work But what if one day you're driving and there's construction and that path that you would normally take is blocked off? What are you going to do? If you want to keep your job, you're probably not going to just turn around and go home. And if you like your car, you're probably not just going to plow straight through the construction. You will go a different way. You'll find a different route. That's an example of rewiring a pattern. So I tell them, I'm like, if you can do that, we can do the same thing with misophonia. It might be a little difficult. It might be tricky. And it might feel like it isn't possible because we've tried so many things that maybe haven't worked. But if you can do something like that, or maybe there was a food that as a kid you really didn't like, like for me, sour cream, I hated it. And now I love it. And that is something that that changed. If I can go from hating sour cream to liking it, surely I can go from hating this noise to not caring about it. So that right there is an example of a story that I might share with someone. It might be more of like you said, close your eyes and kind of going through a hypnotic state to kind of get to those beliefs and programming. It just kind of depends on. the client themselves and what's going to make the most sense.

Unknown Speaker [38:17]: Yeah. I trust you. When did, I guess, so after these sessions, maybe when did it start to, when did you start to notice positive changes and what was that path like? Was it all of a sudden after one of these stories or was it a very gradual decline from 10 to two?

Brooklyn [38:37]: Actually, it went pretty fast. I would say probably within three and a half to four months, I... Yeah, I was there. I do want to add that meditation wasn't just a meditation, say, off of YouTube. They were specific to the same... methodologies and ideas that brooklyn is talking about now where she used some nlp type concepts and hypnotic references in meditations that she shares with her clients and to this day those are the same ones that i'm still listening to repetitively because i feel that they're good maintenance um Yeah, it just didn't take very long. And I would say, backing up, that I did notice a shift after the very first time. Like, something was different. I think it could have just been relief, too, that somebody else was like me, and it could help me. That somehow it could be lessened just by the fact that I didn't feel alone in it. Which is a big deal, right?

Unknown Speaker [39:49]: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. You said maintenance because there's somebody I just interviewed like this week who's who's dealing with hypnosis. And, you know, she's doing she's listening to kind of maintenance sessions of I guess their playbacks of her recordings with her sessions with her hypnotherapist. I'm curious, have you, I don't know, whether experimentally by accident or not, have you kind of like maybe missed some of those maintenance and have you noticed it go up? Or are you doing maintenance just because you enjoy it? I'm just kind of curious.

Brooklyn [40:23]: Yeah, I think it's my new pattern. It's my new pattern. And I've had success with it and I feel comforted by it. I literally go to sleep to it at night. I wake up in the morning and it's the first thing I have in the morning and it sets a tone for the day. And it's a gratitude one that starts my day. I love that one. It's Wash Away Misophonia meditation that I listen to at night. And there is a slew of them. Brooklyn has worked her heart out trying to provide wonderful materials that just truly are inspiring. And those are just my favorites. I've been doing this now almost two years and I find comfort in those and that works for me. She even made me one specific to who I am. She did, which is a big deal. And I listen to that one too, but that's a daytime one usually if I have a daytime. Yeah.

Brooklyn [41:23]: It makes me laugh because the idea of someone like listening to my voice every day when they go to sleep, it makes me laugh.

Brooklyn [41:29]: For almost two years.

Brooklyn [41:31]: Yes. And waking up to your voice. Thank you. But in terms of like maintenance work, that's a question that I get asked too. Like, do I have to do maintenance? and i feel very fortunate because my maintenance is working with people so like we're we're like engaging the unconscious mind mine is listening too so for me the maintenance is like getting to support other people so i haven't had to like as tressie does like she says it's just her new pattern that she listens to certain things that are helpful i don't know if i would have to do that or not because i've been working with people since i worked with her and for me that's like That's my maintenance work. So I would be curious, like if I didn't work with people anymore, I'd be curious to see what I then want to do other things to maintain that progress. I'm not sure.

Brooklyn [42:17]: Question for you, Brooklyn. Since you began working with me, how many people have you worked with?

Brooklyn [42:24]: Oh, that's a good question. I don't know if I have an exact number, because I've worked with people in different ways. So I've worked with like a handful of one on one clients, I've worked with people through I used to do a group program. Now it's like a self paced program. And then I also have people who download my free resources. So I kind of count it all differently. But in terms of people who have like, worked with me in some capacity whether it's paid free whatever i think right now we're at like over 600 people in terms of like paying clients who have either done the program or master class or one-on-one i don't know the exact number i think we're we're shy of a hundred I want to say. I'm not sure of the exact number at this time.

Unknown Speaker [43:03]: Oh, that is amazing.

Unknown Speaker [43:05]: Yeah, that's cool. What's the difference between a master class and a one-on-one? Is a master class multiple people on a Zoom call or something?

Brooklyn [43:12]: Yeah, it's not just like a fancy marketing word, basically. It's kind of like just basically a live training that people can show up to. So typically when I do master classes, I do them for free. I try to do at least four trainings, four free trainings a year. And then one of them, I did it as a paid thing where I walked people through. At the time, I think I had six steps and now I've condensed it into three because who wants to try to go through six different things? So it was like walking them through those three steps and how they can actually start to do those things on their own to get some tangible results. So that's kind of like what it is.

Unknown Speaker [43:47]: cool um yeah so one thing maybe switching gears a slight bit so we've talked about like um you know what mystophonia might be and that kind of like i talked a little bit about childhood and you know self-protection we talked you know and that kind of comes up in a lot of conversations that i have and it comes up with you know some of the hypnosis stuff um i have to ask and you don't have to you know say too much but like around the time when you guys first started noticing misophonia what was going on at home what was going on in your lives do you remember anything you know that that could have caused that child to be confused and basically look for ways to protect itself and maybe starting with tressie if you want to answer that question

Brooklyn [44:36]: My family took foster children, and it was a gift that my parents gave as good Christian people, and they were raising us that way. And we love children. We all still do. We're all very kind and giving to others, very generous. But there were things that scared me about their situations, because I would learn about things that I would have had no knowledge of. None. Yeah, that was scary for me.

Unknown Speaker [45:04]: Gotcha. Yeah.

Brooklyn [45:06]: And also in school, I, again, very quiet, very reserved, very shy, not very outgoing. And I had this thing that I didn't know or understand. And I didn't want to lash out at anybody because I wanted them to like me. But yet I was in my turtle shell because I was shy and reserved. So it further kept me stuck, you know. And so... I don't know. You know, I had a nice childhood for the most part. It's not anything that really stands out other than that. And I don't have any regrets over... our family having foster children, I'm very glad that we could help in that way. I chose differently as a parent myself. I chose that I would make my life's work about helping children versus having children in the home. And I think I chose that based upon how it affected me. But it wasn't altogether bad, and I don't want to say that there weren't a lot of them that just, you know, parents needed a reprieve. They needed a little bit of respite, and then, you know, kids would come to our home. But we had lots of children for different amounts of time, from, you know, an overnight to a weekend to months to years. and we had 56 of them from the time i was in second grade until i graduated and i'd say about second third grade more so is where i was talking about being at the dinner table remembering how miserable that was and that was such an awful experience for me to eat with my family when it shouldn't have been and i knew that so yeah but there was always extras too there was always extra people so

Unknown Speaker [46:48]: Yeah, so a lot of stuff going on, a lot of change. Maybe no big T trauma, I just want to put that on the record, but a lot of probably confusing signals and information that you were getting and stories that probably were not being fully explained to you.

Brooklyn [47:05]: Yes. And I had some, when I was little, I'd had a fall down the stairs and knocked my noggin and my mom said, you know, they just... We did take you to the hospital, but they just kind of looked at you and didn't do anything and sent you home. And so I guess I kind of explored that whole post-traumatic stress as well as the secondary stress that you can get from vicariously experiencing someone else's traumas. But yeah. And I think I was maybe two or three when that happened. Yeah. Life, right?

Unknown Speaker [47:41]: Yeah, exactly. We all experience different things, but we don't necessarily all react the same way. And partly it's because of that situation or something we were predisposed to. But we're all experiments biologically. And so, yeah, you never know how things are going to develop. I don't know, Brooklyn, if you want to maybe shed some light or answer that question on your own childhood.

Brooklyn [48:05]: Sure. So I, I personally don't feel like I know why I have misophonia, or I guess if I described it, I'll be like a point five out of five or point five out of 10. So still have it, I guess. But I don't know why. And I personally don't really. I don't feel like I need that answer. I know for some people it can be really helpful. So for example, I actually am working with a client where we could easily pinpoint it. When she was younger, they would like turn on the AC in her house and it'd be really cold and her ears were sensitive. So her ears would start to hurt. So she associated the sound of like the AC with pain in her ears and then all these other sounds developed. And so it's like, well, of course you experienced misophonia. That makes so much sense. And that was really helpful for us to, talk about and kind of rewire that connection. I know for me, I feel like it started when I was a bit younger and I was always really sensitive. Like if I grew up today, I feel like my parents probably may have had me tested for autism. I had a lot of things that you would like pick from the spectrum. So I had a really difficult time. like communicating my emotions. Like I remember I was, I think I was like 14, 15 and I was in a therapy session that my mom joined in and she was like crying, like expressing how challenging things had been between us and like with my misophonia and everything. And I was laughing. because I was so uncomfortable. I just didn't know what to do. Those things used to be really, I'm like, I don't know what to do with these emotions. I don't know. And when I was younger, they had to cut off the edges of my socks where the seam meets, because the sensation of it was frustrating. Tags in my shirts. I couldn't wear jeans until like my freshman year of high school because of the sensory like issue that I had with it. So I was always a bit sensitive. And then I don't know if this is related at all. It could be. Maybe not. I don't know. But when I was in third grade or around nine years old, my dad was also in a pretty significant motorcycle accident where he almost lost his leg and it. completely transformed the way that our family functioned because he was not really mobile for a long time. And so we had to take care of him. And just the family dynamic totally changed, which ironically now I use his motorcycle accident as a metaphor to support me in helping people with misophonia. But I'm sure that that played into it. Well, it's just our total like our family dynamic totally changed when I was really young, too. wow and then you did mention like um you you don't have a lot of memories before 19 is that kind of an exaggeration or or no i just have a really bad memory and my mom does as well like she has no idea what our first words are she's forgotten a lot of stuff from our like i just have a very bad memory i didn't have like a horribly traumatic childhood like we had all the things we needed and our parents were really involved and all that stuff yeah i don't i just have a very bad memory

Unknown Speaker [51:07]: Yeah, yeah. Cool. And yeah, so you mentioned other senses, and people who listen to the podcast know that. I was like, I think misophonia, I think sound is the hardest thing to block out if our brain is looking for some kind of a warning. So it doesn't surprise me that, again, misophonia, then it's the visuals as an anticipation. Tressie, misokinesia, your experience with that and other senses, I'm curious, did that all develop as well?

Brooklyn [51:35]: I think I was more focused on the mouth noises and just the footsteps and the movement and stuff. But yeah, the movement was the music kinesia. You know, my mom would fidget on her leg. And everyone has a nervous tick of some sort, don't we? We all have that.

Unknown Speaker [51:56]: Got the jimmy legs, yeah.

Brooklyn [51:57]: Yeah, right. But she would do that. I remember I just kind of put my hand over her hand, like, stop. You know, it's getting me. I don't... I guess that's all I can recall right now. And I think it's good when you don't remember stuff, because that means you're past it.

Unknown Speaker [52:21]: Did you, but did you, I'm just kidding, did you find, like, any sensitivities to, or maybe it's a question for Polka as well, but, like, in your work with clients or, Tress, in your experience, does the mesokinesia maybe go away as well around the same time, in the same kind of way as misophonia?

Brooklyn [52:41]: I never really paid that much attention to the mesokinesia. To be quite honest with you, I don't know how much that... that was part of it or not i think just in my research i just learned more about it and thought oh that's what that is yeah oh okay you know i just feel like i was a late bloomer in terms of figuring it all out but i've now connected dots and um it's you know the puzzle is complete and and i get it but i'm i'm really concerned oh go ahead

Unknown Speaker [53:13]: Well, no, I was going to ask because you did mention some other conditions that contributed to you. Sorry, I keep waving my hands. I'll stop doing that. You mentioned some of the other conditions that kind of led you to your low point. Have you noticed a kind of a general lift as well, or has it been more focused on the misophonia?

Brooklyn [53:31]: I've just had a lot of medicine changes, you know, just going through menopause and Hashimoto's. I've just had a lot. And... I think not having misophonia on top of it has helped, but I still had those. I just did. I have. It just lessened the list of things I was trying to deal with, right? And that's always a blessing.

Unknown Speaker [53:59]: Yeah, yeah. No, that's great. Yeah, I mean, it can definitely be this big cloud that kind of like drains our energy. Well, speaking of that, I mean, HSPs, highly sensitive people, we feel drained. Is that a term that you've seen? Have you resonated with that?

Brooklyn [54:19]: Oh, definitely. Definitely. So I just want to say that, you know, I feel like... Like my other senses had to overcompensate for what wasn't working well. But I just even go back to my youth and I think about the light sensitivity, socks, confining clothes, itchy. I mean, it was not just that that bothered me. I mean, I could have a complete and total meltdown. I think there's a spectrum there too. But... and then serving kids in the school system as both a teacher and a school counselor, I recognize a lot of these things now. It's in hindsight, because I'm no longer working professionally in those roles, but I definitely had an understanding for what they were experiencing. I could relate. I wanted to say that my... My book, Guided by True North, talks about advocating for this condition to be recognized as its own condition in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Health Disorders. I just feel like that's something that has to give. They keep wanting to... categorize us with other things. And I think people may have a list, just like I have been dealing with the things that I've mentioned. And misophonia is just one more thing. But that doesn't mean that everybody that is a misophone has the same other conditions. I think it truly needs to be isolated and acknowledged.

Unknown Speaker [56:01]: Yeah. I think there's a lot, a lot of, a lot of us are pushing towards that. I would like to see that or, and are confused as to why it isn't the case yet. I know it's like a every 10 year thing or something. So yeah. So, and we're, so we're getting, yeah, I guess we're getting about, see, it flies by. I think I mentioned it during our call. Yeah. you kind of don't even don't even realize it um but yeah i'd love to kind of like obviously here maybe as we're wrapping up uh we can talk about all that you know we mentioned the book a bunch of times brooklyn your your you know your work as well we'll have the website and all that stuff in the notes um but maybe uh maybe real quick just kind of on the flip side like uh you know brooklyn you mentioned you get you get a lot of you got some pushback from the facebook group what did you learn about like how do you explain that like i'm sure there's still people who might be because you know there's all these different there's the hypnosis stuff there's all kinds of different modalities how do you how do you talk about that now like what do you what do you tell people and how do you feel about like the the um you know the pushback first for certain modalities

Brooklyn [57:04]: Oh, gosh, that's a, that's a good question. And actually, it took me, it took me a while to get comfortable with that. And I want to say to this kind of touches on it. But I want to say to like, it's amazing that Tressie did put those books out there because a lot of people I've noticed from myself, my own experience growing up and people that I work with do not want people to know that they have misophonia. because people even in the misophonia community there's gatekeeping within it of like oh well that's not it's not bad enough you don't have misophonia you wouldn't get it that's something else and then there's also people who don't experience it and they're like you're crazy like i've seen comments on social media that are so keyboard warriors going at it like you like i had a an ad that i put out and it's like if you yelled at someone for the way that they chew then you're my kind of person and somebody wrote if you're yelling at someone for the way that they chew then you have a problem it's like okay sir this is not a useful comment like i'm trying to help people here so or you know people don't want others to know because then people will make noises on purpose to like make them uncomfortable people did that to me growing up yeah so the fact that you put those books out there and that you're willing to be a voice for that i love that and that's always what i wanted to do as well because i never wanted people to know that i had it and then once i got relief from it that's when i felt comfortable sharing so i'm like okay people can't hold this power over me anymore And also I just see it differently instead of feeling like there's something wrong with me. It's like, oh, this is just the way that my brain was processing things. Like everyone has something like that in terms of like the pushback in the Facebook group. I honestly am still hesitant to post in some of them in one in particular because there's always the skeptics that come running. And I've had people like accuse me of like sleazy marketing or just trying to make money or this and that and that. that was really really difficult for me to absorb because i want to help people so badly like i know how miserable it is to live with misophonia and i genuinely want to help as many people as i can that's why i offer so much free stuff that's why i try to like i just try to do everything that i can or just at least try to be a voice of like there is hope even if it's not through me if it's through another therapist or practitioner or another modality that i don't use there are people out there experiencing relief like if i can do it someone who is super anxious super depressed if i can do that for myself i truly believe anyone can do it so i've gotten to a place where it's like at this point i just don't really care if people are saying these things about me or if there is skepticism because there was skepticism when i first posted and tressie saw through that and decided to work with me and she's been able to experience some really incredible things Right. There may be some people who, you know, like I've said, they've tried things before. I can understand that skepticism. I really can. Like they've tried many, many things and they don't work. And you're just protecting yourself from disappointment. Right. And maybe there's even a desire to protect other people. So for me, I still get some of that pushback. Some people have even said, like, I never had misophonia in the first place. So I've gotten some some things like that.

Unknown Speaker [60:20]: Yeah.

Brooklyn [60:21]: Yes. But for me, it's worth it to to post and try to put it out there. And sometimes I do have to market in weird ways. Like I I did a reel where I had my husband like eating Cheez-Its and I pied him in the face because I want to get people's attention because people can't get support or help if they don't even know I exist. So I've kind of learned like there's always going to be some of that like Internet, social media. trolling and skepticism and mean comments but being able to help people is worth it is worth more than any of that other stuff hopefully that kind of answered yeah of course and and so where should people go uh the which website and then urls and social media good question so because i'll put them in the notes but in case people don't read they can listen to you so my main instagram is just my name brooklyn dish d-i-s-c-h but it'll be listed so people can find it but also you can go to rewire misophonia.com that's like my main website or brooklyndish.com it all goes to the same place but also i encourage people to start with the free stuff like if you don't know what coaching with me is like before you give me any of your money do the free stuff So like Let's Ditch Misophonia on YouTube, I have a whole bunch of videos. I have EFT tutorials. I have a free PDF that you can download that walks you through the steps. That's on the website. And then if you want to keep going, then I have that self-paced program, which is less than $250. So I've really tried to make it as accessible as possible. And that will walk you through, you know, again, those steps. There's coaching sessions in there, the audios that Tressie talked about. There's workbooks because... Obviously for a program, I have to make it more general because I don't know every single person going through it. So those workbooks will help you personalize it for your experience specifically. There's so many resources in there. And then if you go through that and you're like, I want that one-on-one support from Brooklyn, you can then take the investment from the program and apply it to one-on-one coaching. So you don't have to buy both. So I always encourage people start with the free stuff, duh, because if you start getting relief from something that's free, why would you pay any money? And then you can start to kind of move up as you as you feel necessary. So those are kind of the places to find the stuff that I do.

Unknown Speaker [62:31]: Cool. Yeah, no, super helpful. And yeah, maybe trusty as well. Any kind of like, well, your URLs and kind of final thoughts?

Brooklyn [62:42]: Sure. So my author website is www.tracymitchell.com. And my books are sold in four different formats on Amazon, Kindle, Barnes and Noble. What am I missing? Google. Yeah.

Brooklyn [62:59]: I just read that recently.

Brooklyn [63:01]: Copy your head. Thank you. Yes. And. I just really appreciate you having us on like this. I just really wanted to acknowledge Brooklyn. I am very grateful to her and wanted others to know about the positive experience that I had working with her. And, you know, being one of her first ones and being open-minded was key. So if you're open-minded and you just want some improvement, maybe it doesn't go away completely, but if it improves your life at all, it's worth your effort and it certainly was worth mine. And so I just, I wanted this time to let Brooklyn shine.

Unknown Speaker [63:36]: Thank you for coming on. Thank you for reaching out. It's funny. It's not even honestly a side project. It's not even my main side project, so I usually don't reach out to people. But I definitely wanted to have Brooklyn on and trust you. I saw your book at somebody else's house, so I was like, oh, I should reach out. But, yes, thanks for what you got. This has been an amazing conversation that I know is going to enlighten a lot of people. I look forward to having it out there. I appreciate you, Adeel.

Brooklyn [64:02]: Thank you. Thank you.

Unknown Speaker [64:03]: Thanks again, Tressie and Brooklyn. It was great to find the chat. Everyone, please check out all the links in these show notes. If you liked this episode, don't forget to leave a quick rating or review wherever you listen to this show. You can hit me up by email at hello at mystifoniapodcast.com or go to the website mystifoniapodcast.com. It's even easier just to send a message on Instagram at Missifunny Podcast. You can follow there on Missifunny Podcast. On Twitter, it's Missifunny Show or Axe, I should say. And actually, we are now on Blue Sky as Missifunny Podcast. Support the show by visiting Missifunny.shop. Theme music, as always, is by Moby. And until next week, wishing you peace and quiet.

Unknown Speaker [65:25]: you