Andrew - Finding Harmony and Career Choices with Misophonia

S1 E2 - 11/20/2019
This episode features Andrew, a graphic designer from Tacoma, Washington, who has never met anyone else with misophonia in person. He shares his deep insights into his experiences, highlighting a particular focus on the positive dynamic he has with his partner amidst his misophonia challenges. Andrew discusses his journey with misophonia, which began around puberty, and how it has influenced various aspects of his life, including his choice of career in graphic design, which allows him to work remotely and avoid triggering environments. Additionally, he recounts a memorable Thanksgiving incident triggered by his misophonia, which led to an outburst at the dinner table. The episode offers practical advice for managing misophonia, emphasizing the importance of self-talk and developing resilience over time. Both Andrew and the host, Adeel, advocate for perseverance and self-awareness in navigating the complexities of misophonia, offering hope and encouragement to others dealing with the condition.


Adeel [0:02]: Hello, welcome to the Misophonia podcast. This is episode two. My name is Adeel Ahmad, and I have Misophonia. On this week's episode, I share a great conversation I had with Andrew, a graphic designer who lives in Tacoma, Washington. Like many people, Andrew has never really met anyone else with miso in person, and so has never had this kind of a conversation. But as you can tell, he's thought deeply about his experiences for a long time and has some great insights. I think he'll be particularly interested in the positive dynamic he has with his partner. Before we get started, just a reminder that I'm adding some brown noise to the background of all these interviews to help mask triggers, in case you're wondering what that sound is. I'd love to get feedback on that or anything about the show. Just email hello at or through any social channel. I also want to give a quick shout out to another podcast that was sort of an inspiration as I was researching other podcasts that deal with misunderstood conditions. for ideas on interview style, tone, content. And that's the Tourette's podcast by Ben Brown, which features his conversations with people with Tourette's syndrome. I make a really casual reference to it at the beginning of this podcast, but I wanted to highlight it here because Ben's created a show that's extremely well produced and insightful, even for people who don't have Tourette's. And I hope to achieve some of what he's done with the Misophonia podcast. He was extremely kind when I reached out about my podcast, and I'm grateful for that. You should find a band on the Tourette's podcast to check it out. All right, without further ado, hope you enjoy my conversation with Andrew. So, yeah, so welcome, Andrew. Glad to have you here. Thanks for having me.

Andrew [1:39]: I'm excited that someone's doing something like this. It's definitely different.

Adeel [1:44]: yeah yeah no it's very niche and there's nothing like that i mean there's a there's a there's a great actually podcast about Tourette's and i'm like if Tourette's is a podcast we should have a podcast too you know yeah so and it's similar thing it's like just people coming on talking about their experiences and even have a sponsor and i'm like wow You got a sponsor already? They're not us. They're Tourette's, so I got nothing. Oh, okay. I was like, wait, what? This is totally, yeah, no, no. Dang, you're doing good, man. This is totally DIY. Yeah, so tell me a little bit about where you're located.

Andrew [2:15]: So I actually just moved to Tacoma, Washington. I moved from Colorado Springs about two and a half weeks ago. Wow. OK, well, brought you there like a job or? So, well, so two years prior, I lived in St. Louis, moved to Colorado for school. I separated from the Air Force and I I kind of grew up from like my teen years onward in Colorado. And that's where all my family is. So I moved back there for school, brought my wife with me. But my wife already has her degree. She has her master's in historic preservation. And she wasn't finding any work in Colorado Springs or Colorado in general. Gotcha. So we ended up finding work out here for her. And neither of us have lived on the West Coast. So we were interested to see what life is like out here. Oh, it's nice. I lived many years.

Adeel [3:11]: Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah, my first job out of school was in Seattle, actually. Oh, nice. Yeah, that's a nice part. I mean, Tacoma is great, too. It gets kind of like a bum rap, but I like Tacoma.

Andrew [3:25]: It's not bad. I really like the area. Everyone's been friendly so far. It's definitely, from how everyone describes it, it's nowhere near as bad as St. Louis was. Like the certain parts of St. Louis.

Adeel [3:40]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Cool. And so you said your wife is doing work there, and you were a student. What's your kind of day-to-day?

Andrew [3:49]: Oh, yeah. I didn't really elaborate on that. So I'm still a full-time student. I transferred schools, and now I'm 100% online. So that kind of opened up availability to my wife. Wherever we found work, we could move there. So I am currently in school for graphic design.

Adeel [4:08]: Gotcha, and that's great. So you're doing it online. You don't have to go in and hear anybody around you.

Andrew [4:14]: No, it's actually really cool. They do lectures online, and it's live, so you can actually talk. It's different, but I much prefer it to the classroom personally.

Adeel [4:29]: Oh, so is it like a call with a lot of other students on the call at the same time?

Andrew [4:35]: It depends. So the first couple classes, which, you know, the standard introductory classes, there was a lot of students because they combined. Like it was just one teacher would give a lecture to like four classes. So there's a lot of people and it was... Like the text box was just everyone like video games. Do you like to play and stuff? There's no moderation. It's horrible. But once you start getting into like the actual core classes, it's so much better.

Adeel [5:04]: So I was wondering, so you get the text box. Do you also hear their sounds too all at the same time? Or is it a little bit more civilized? Oh, no.

Andrew [5:13]: So everyone's muted standardly. Gotcha. Right off the bat. But if he asks a question, there's like a little button to raise your hand. And then from there, like if he calls on you, he unmutes you and you actually like converse with him. Gotcha. Sorry. Okay. My current teacher is a male. Okay. Yeah.

Adeel [5:31]: Yeah, yeah. Cool. Okay, okay. Well, yeah, it's great. And then graphic design is something you can probably do independently as well. I don't know if you've thought about... Did you choose this with any kind of misophonia in the back of your head telling you that, you know, here's a career that I could kind of do on my own or not be bothered too much?

Andrew [5:52]: A little bit. I wouldn't say it was the driving factor. Yeah. But I currently already... have a job doing graphic design that I do remotely. And it's very nice to be able to, like, control the environment. Yeah.

Adeel [6:10]: And we'll get to some of your mechanisms and all that stuff and gear later, armor, I call it, actually. So how long you had Misophonia then, as far back as you remember? So it's been...

Andrew [6:26]: Mine kind of aligns with, from what I've seen at the whatever research has been done, kind of points to is that that point where you kind of hit puberty and like your brain starts going through massive changes. So I'd say since maybe like 13 years old or so is when it started developing. Yeah, it seems very average.

Adeel [6:50]: Do you know, were there particular people who were your first triggers? Yes, my father.

Andrew [6:56]: Again, very constant. Yeah, he is chewing. Yeah. It's like, I don't remember like the tipping point as like when it started happening, which is really weird. It's like kind of when I started, I'm not blind, but like I have really bad vision. It's like that transition from being able to see clearly to having horrible vision where you need glasses. You don't realize you need glasses because it's so subtle. Gotcha. Until you, like once I figured out what misophonia was, I was just like... this is it yeah this is me yeah you find out about it back then or or later oh no yeah um so i was already uh graduated out of high school and in college my first attempt at college before yeah before the air force um and my sister sent me it was like in a meme format almost meme not mean format but not a meme like a funny kind of thing yeah

Adeel [7:55]: um and she was like haha this is so you and i looked into it and i was like i know you're trying to be funny but like i i think this is actually me so she's okay so so your sister sent your sister sent you this meme haha like this is this is you yeah because obviously she she doesn't have it right or oh no no one in my family but she'd obviously yeah they'd all have seen you freak out about it over the years and

Andrew [8:23]: Yeah, and it wasn't like a, I don't know. I haven't seen a single person. I've never met anyone that has it. But I've never, I watched this documentary, like Quiet Please or something like that.

Adeel [8:40]: Yeah, it's a great one.

Andrew [8:41]: And everyone on there was saying that. their family, like when they're, as they're being raised, their family never really wasn't supportive of them. It was, they kind of just saw it as like, why are you, that's different. That's, that's not a real thing. It's why are you being an asshole?

Adeel [8:56]: Yeah.

Andrew [8:56]: Why are you being an asshole? Like we're just chewing and eating our food and you know, you got no other option just to hold it in.

Adeel [9:05]: You know, it gets roped into the, you know, fingers on a chalkboard like that. You know, everyone uses that annoying thing that's yeah. Okay, fine. Yeah. That's, that's,

Andrew [9:14]: the cliche but it's this is something on another level so oh yeah it's the the nails on a chalkboard is just i mean yeah it's a universal sound of like everyone just cringes because it's an unpleasant high frequency kind of yeah it's almost painful but misophony isn't it's not really pain it is is a little bit but like It's not that kind of pain. It's more of like an internal just... Like a fight or flight. Fight or flight, yeah. For some reason, a sound is making you scared for your life. It doesn't make any sense. Right, right, right. That's all it is.

Adeel [9:49]: Yeah, all you can do. Well, yeah, like somebody else in our podcast was saying, you just have to laugh at it almost. It is. It can't be that absurd. So, okay, so your dad was your first trigger around puberty. Yeah, that's, yeah, very common. I know you haven't met anybody, but that's very, very common. And then did it, like, expand to other people or other sounds during those, you know, formative years? Yeah, so, I mean, it's not really...

Andrew [10:22]: towards certain people. It's... My dad is just the first one that I realized because his was so bad. Like, just the way he chewed was so bad. But still, like, my sister and my stepmom, they... always the they wouldn't be as bad if we were eating with my father because you'd notice kind of like a hierarchy it's like oh this person is like the biggest threat because they're chewing the worst so it kind of drowns out the other ones yeah so they still did it if i was just with them but did your sister ever tease you i know she did the mean thing that was ever um so provoke kind of thing or I wouldn't say everybody. My wife certainly doesn't tease me. She's really supportive of that. But my family before even Mr. Pony was even like a name, like a known name, they would purposefully chew

Adeel [11:24]: badly not badly but like more obnoxiously yeah uh kind of just to to see my reaction i guess you could say that's fun yeah it's always fun um and so how did so as a kid like how did you handle it you know you obviously got a ton of other shit going on in your life um yeah my my Were you just kind of confused? There wasn't a name. Were you just kind of confused or just think that, hey, I'm not getting along with my dad or annoyed? I just have an extra annoyance or something.

Andrew [12:02]: Yeah. I didn't really know what to think, honestly. Clearly no one else was bothered by this. Right. You know, people would say, yeah, of course it's annoying when people chew obnoxiously. I was like, no, that's not the point. It's not annoying. I mean, it is annoying, but it's so much more than that. And it was so weird that nobody else...

Adeel [12:29]: had the same reaction that i felt and i was like is everyone just internalizing this so much better than me um did it affect school did it affect like you know exams and so i feel like i luckily got out without it affecting school if i were to try to do school now i'd be well in a classroom setting as opposed to online i'd be like wouldn't be able to concentrate, but I was curious if it affected anything there for you.

Andrew [12:56]: So I am not 100% certain. I don't really have a good gauge for that. I didn't really care for school too much as a kid, sadly. So my grades weren't the best, so I couldn't really tell you if I suffered because of that. That wasn't the reason why they weren't bad. But having gone back to an actual in-class setting for a year in college, I can definitely say that it's really common to just for students to bring snacks and like bags of chips and just bags of anything. And that definitely drowns out what the teacher is saying. But I generally like to sit in the front of the class because I'm actually there to learn now. Yeah, yeah.

Adeel [13:44]: Sitting at the front though, don't you get the rush of everything coming from behind you and suffocating you? Or I sometimes wonder, is it better at the front or better at the back?

Andrew [13:53]: That's a good point. I never really thought about it like that.

Adeel [13:58]: At the back, the sound is in front of you and you're closer to the door. You can just get the fuck out of there.

Andrew [14:03]: Yeah, just leave. Yeah, I never really thought about that. I sat at the front because I wanted to focus more.

Adeel [14:11]: I wanted to have... Well, you won't get any visual triggers either. Exactly, yeah. Unless your professor is sick, then you're kind of screwed.

Andrew [14:20]: And I never knew that was a thing. Up until actually fairly recently, that visual triggers were a thing. I thought that was something else.

Adeel [14:27]: Yeah, I've heard of it more. I heard about it quite a bit more at that convention last week. It's funny that people are talking about visual triggers more.

Andrew [14:36]: Yeah, like even if there's no sound, I personally find eating extremely repulsive. Like just watching someone eat, it looks disgusting. I don't know why. I can eat just fine. And I can chew just fine. But as far as like watching someone else eat.

Adeel [14:53]: Well, all sorts of disgusting animals do the same thing. We're just another animal. Yeah. Yeah. And did you, so when you're eating, so obviously eating is a big, you know, has its issues. Are there things you learned to do to get around other than getting out of there? Like, do you eat a lot faster? Do you kind of try not to sit, like, try to like, not to sit down so long at family meals and whatnot? Maybe, you know, try to walk around or volunteer to wash dishes or something or?

Andrew [15:31]: um or just deal with it or yeah my my uh my route that i've always taken is to sit there in pain and yeah just have that constant feeling um what i what i like to do is i'll often to me it seems like i'm being very obvious with how i'm acting but i've never really had anyone call me out like why are you acting so weird um i will just cover my ears uh generally have like a finger in each ear and kind of just wiggle them a little bit to drown out the chewing with the the muffled kind of just scratching yeah sound that's that's what yeah that definitely

Adeel [16:13]: Definitely heard that. People have been also talking about mimicking. So just like if you... And I don't know how this would work in that kind of environment, but copying that sound. Like if somebody is triggered by eating chips... themselves eating chips louder. Yeah. The mimicking is also a coping mechanism that people use.

Andrew [16:34]: Yes. Yeah. Like just now when I was my wife and I were having nachos for lunch, me eating those nachos kind of drowns out her chewing. But like I have to try and chew when she's chewing. Yeah. Or turn up the TV that we're watching. Gotcha. Pretty substantially to try and mask it in between the whole chewing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, that definitely works to a certain degree.

Adeel [17:01]: Gotcha. So how, yeah. So how, okay. So moving on to guess kind of, you know, now ish, like how does it affect your life today? Obviously like literally today it affected your, your, you know, your consumption of nachos with your wife. Life, life altering. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so you kind of go to school in an online environment. Is there other situations where you have to deal with it quite often? There's not...

Andrew [17:34]: So one thing that my wife is asking about is she's like, how can you enjoy movies? Yeah. Because it's just what you do when you go to the theaters. Yes. Chew on popcorn. You eat popcorn.

Adeel [17:47]: A lot of people just don't. A lot of people just don't go to theaters.

Andrew [17:50]: Yeah.

Adeel [17:51]: Thank God for like Netflix and SRAM Sound. Oh, yeah.

Andrew [17:57]: I would have to say that with a movie, generally they're loud to where it only bothers me in those quiet scenes in between. But I went and saw Midsommar. I don't know if you've seen that.

Adeel [18:15]: You haven't seen it?

Andrew [18:16]: No, I haven't seen that yet. It is one of the most quietest movies I've ever watched, and it was painful. It was... Before... Up until everyone, like, finished their popcorn and their stuff, you know, it's... It was painful just because every noise was super audible. Just because there's... There's almost, like, no soundtrack to that movie. It's all just, like, dialogue, but it's not necessarily loud dialogue, so... Right. It... It was... I enjoyed the movie, but...

Adeel [18:49]: it was bad it was not yeah those kinds of movies I would probably wait to see it to see it at home that's I think what I'm waiting to do for that one I'll probably see action movies but I can't say action movies so I don't really watch them so I have no other reason to go there unless it's I have to take the kids to a kids movie but then I usually try to go to one with a couch and a bar and fall asleep or something But, yeah, movies, a lot of people just ignore. I tried to use one of those, you know, every movie theater has got those, like, audio tour kind of headset kind of things that basically turn up the volume. It's not noise canceling, but it turns up the volume. And it's like a headphone of the dialogue and everything. They have those? Yeah, yeah. It's federally mandated, like ADA kind of thing. And so you can ask them at the front to get this, like, it looks like an audio tour at a museum. And so, um, so it's like, it's like an audio tour guide kind of thing. And I think it just turns up the, the, um, the dialogue. So it's meant for like hearing impaired. And a lot of people have talked about it, you know, on Facebook groups, but I, I just, I didn't find it that interesting. It just, it turned up the, the dialogue, but it turned up all the high frequencies of the person talking. And it just, it just kind of sounded kind of gross. Anyways. Um, I've never, never seen those. Yeah, they're not. I mean, I, I, I didn't really know about it until, um, somebody mentioned Facebook group for Misophonia and, uh, but it is like at every theater. It's like a better, it took a lot. So they need that for like carrying the pain. Yeah. So, I mean, you might want to try that, but, uh, I could try asking, but yeah, you get, I mean, we're worth trying just for an experience. You don't have to wear it the whole time, but yeah, cause it's free. So, you know, um, Nice. So yeah, movie theaters. Okay. So yeah, so you sound like relatively you have a, you've kind of like negotiated your life in a way that it's manageable. Yeah. That you're able to manage it more.

Andrew [20:47]: I've had a lot of experience with like repressing it. Yes. That... It still bothers me to the same extent, but I have so much training to just keep it in that it's not a... It's not going to destroy my life. Like on that documentary, that one woman. Right. I felt really bad because it was breaking down every time she was talking about it.

Adeel [21:19]: It took me three tries to finish watching that movie. I couldn't sit through it. Yeah, it was difficult. Yeah, a lot of people were having a hard time. And so we talked to... So what kind of... Do you use any gear? I've got different form factors of... Over the ear, you know, what you're wearing, wired and wireless in case my, you know, batteries run low or whatever. Anything or earplugs? I don't want to use earplugs. I'm curious what you kind of carry around with you.

Andrew [21:52]: So I don't have any gear. Recently, I've seen on the subreddit as well as on that documentary that they have those almost reversed hearing aids kind of things that drown out and muffle out certain sounds. I would be interested in getting those. I at the current moment don't like have the funds to to buy them but I'd love to try those out but um as long as we're in the household like I have some over-the-ear headphones that like the sound canceling yeah yeah favorite super nice Yeah, that's also another thing that I don't know if this is in pair with with misophonia, but my like and also like I played music almost my whole life. I have very sensitive ears to just sound in general and like I can hear tones very clearly and like differentiate certain tones and hear like undertones and that kind of thing.

Adeel [23:02]: More than just perfect pitch like you can hear.

Andrew [23:05]: take apart a take apart a chord or something and hear that yeah and and like um a lot of what i what i i like to do is when i really like a song i like kind of dissecting the layers of it that when you listen to a song it's kind of just it's meant to be everything at once and a lot of and like a lot of pop music um people don't realize that that the singer's voice is generally two different pitches of the singer singing the same line and paired together. They can't hear those two voices. They just hear it as one voice. But I can hear, like, there's multiple layers of the same person singing that.

Adeel [23:45]: Yeah, kind of like sometimes it's artificially done with a chorus effect, but sometimes they double track it, and yeah, it makes it more interesting. more than just harmony. Like they literally will repeat the same thing and just to give it a little bit of depth. Yeah. Just the overlay. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. No, that's interesting. Yeah. It's yeah. I don't know if it's universally like, um, it's the funny people are have like perfect pitch or anything, but, uh, yeah, definitely. I've definitely heard that. Uh, and also I've heard people that like, uh, we'll go to a concert and hear everything happening in the room, not just the stage, but like behind you conversations besides you. So your wife is really then the only main person around you and she seems pretty supportive.

Andrew [24:31]: Yeah, she's very supportive. We watched the documentary together. Okay. I'd never seen it. We watched it the first time together. Yeah. Because I was hoping that it would further explain in, like, other people's words what it's like as opposed to mine because I'm really bad at explaining things. But even before that, I mean, she's always been great.

Adeel [24:52]: Do you tell other people as well?

Andrew [24:55]: I didn't mean to interrupt you there. No, it's fine.

Adeel [24:57]: Not...

Andrew [25:00]: I'm in the boat of the people that feel really bad about inconveniencing other people to stop a completely normal activity or to be conscious of a perfectly normal activity to compensate for my... I don't want to use the word need. Right. But a very... I don't know how to explain it.

Adeel [25:26]: Strong desire.

Andrew [25:27]: If not need, it's definitely a... It's a very strong desire.

Adeel [25:31]: It's not life or death in the real sense, but it definitely feels that way.

Andrew [25:37]: It makes you feel that way, yeah. And so, like, I... I tell some people, my wife has definitely told some people and she's awesome for doing that. I still feel a little bad having people compensate that for me, but I am definitely appreciative and very, very happy when they do because I feel a lot better.

Adeel [26:03]: Yeah. And you haven't, and like I think you said earlier, you haven't met any other MISA phones, right? I haven't, no. Gotcha. Well, it's going to be a lot. There's a lot of listening to you right now. So that's, and then there are quite a few, like the convention gets a couple hundred people. It's going to be in Philly next year. So we're hoping that I'm not, I'm not part of any organization committee, but it would be cool if that kind of like blows it up a little bit even more because it will be so close to Philly, obviously Philly, but also New York. So there are a lot of people around and what they, what we like to do is just like talking about it with somebody else who has it is like, you know, a whole other level. You could probably feel that probably from the documentary.

Andrew [26:44]: Yeah, and even with the subreddit, when I found the subreddit, it was like, wow, there's a community?

Adeel [26:50]: It's a big one, yeah.

Andrew [26:51]: I haven't commented too much on stuff. Every now and again I do. I'm mostly like a lurker on Reddit, but if someone's asking for help, I'll give mine two cents and see if I can help them out.

Adeel [27:07]: And so, yeah, I know it's great. And that's, I think that that's a red, it's got like 20, 30,000. Like there's the biggest face group group just hit 20,000 as well. And growing, like there's always somebody, there's always new people learning about it. There's somebody new listening to you right now, probably just learning about it right now. So, um, I think, I think it's going to grow. Um, so the holidays are coming up. Do you, uh, are you going to be seeing your family for the holidays? Probably not this year. Okay.

Andrew [27:34]: Um, we spent like all of our money to move out here. So we're getting back up on our feet. So it'll be a holiday season just together, but that'll be nice still.

Adeel [27:44]: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Um, yeah, a lot of, I think a lot of, a lot of us are, um, Not dreading, but preparing for, you know, preparing for getting our escape routes. Thanksgiving. Yeah, yeah.

Andrew [27:58]: The worst of all. I do have a story about a Thanksgiving. Please, sure. It was the first, and I'm not going to say only Thanksgiving. Because I have, I guess you could say, like, lost it. I lost control a couple times. But it's very rare. Thanksgiving, I was still in high school. That was before I knew what Miss Phony was. I was just confused and angry. So, my step-grandfather was in town. Like, my step-grandparents and my whole, like, step-extended family came for Thanksgiving. And my step-grandfather was, we were all eating at the table. And I thought my dad was bad. And this was just a whole other level of just obnoxious eating. Yeah. And I tried to hold it in for so long, but I ended up just, you know, it's like fist slamming the table and just like screaming at him. Yeah. Looking back, it's like kind of cringy and it's like I feel really bad that I did that. But in the moment, it's just like if I don't do this, like I'm going to hurt somebody. I don't want to hurt somebody. Yeah. Because, like, for me personally, I find – because some people, it's, like, it's fight or flight is what it triggers. Some people are just, like, I need to leave. Like, that's their flight. Their body chooses flight. Mine gets very angry. It's, like – Yeah. Bad thoughts that I do not want to have.

Adeel [29:44]: Oh, absolutely.

Andrew [29:44]: I do not normally have. And so it just goes straight into fight. But repressing that causes like crazy anxiety and like my heart starts racing adrenaline. And so it hit a limit where I couldn't hold it anymore. I probably went a little too overboard and I definitely walked away after that. Yeah. I had to explain that I'm weird. Like, I don't know what's wrong with me. I'm sorry I screamed at you. But you were eating like a madman. Right.

Adeel [30:13]: Well, it makes, yeah, it just makes you think irrationally sometimes. And that's just, I think, you know, everybody at some point probably, whether it's music for your non-experience, something like that. Oh, yeah. What is your, I'm just curious what your step-grandfather said. Or how he responded.

Andrew [30:33]: I don't have complete remembrance of what happened after I screamed. I know my stepmom wasn't happy. I don't remember what my step-grandfather said. I think he was just in shock.

Adeel [30:49]: Yeah.

Andrew [30:50]: He wasn't quite sure what just happened because he's just eating. Yeah. And all of a sudden, you know, grandson's just screaming at you. Right. I don't... When that generally happens, it's kind of like... I wouldn't say like, I guess it is kind of like somewhat of like a safe space in my mind. It's just kind of blacks out and it's just like, breathe, relax. You're okay. I walked away and I don't remember much after that, except for my stepmom being pretty pissed.

Adeel [31:23]: Yeah. Yeah. Understandable, I guess. But yeah. Interesting. Well, yeah, I'm hoping not too much of that happens to folks this holiday season, but you know it will. Good luck. Breathe. Yeah, exactly. Cool. Well, anything else you'd like to tell people who know they have it or are just learning it for the first time and probably relating to what you're going through or what you have going through?

Andrew [31:50]: I would... Basically, just, I guess, don't give up. In my personal experience, it may not be the best route, I guess, but for me personally, just focusing really hard on the problem and just i guess finding that that that space in your head where you can talk yourself through it can be very beneficial um just remember to like breathe and i i know when when you hear these noises that like that is the only thing on your mind no matter what you're doing everything is gone and that's the only noise and just echoes and echoes and it can drive you mad but try to, I guess, focus on that that's what's happening and realize what's going on and take a step back. And I don't want to say repress it, but with me, like years and years and years of repressing, it has kind of built up not an immunity, but a resistance to negative reactions in response to those lenses. So, uh, I don't know. I don't know if that would help anybody.

Adeel [33:16]: Yeah, and you also probably know with experience that the sound will be, even though it doesn't feel like it, it will end at some point, whether it's the end of the meal or whatever. There is an end. It takes an unusual and always a surprising amount of time to kind of decompress after that, but you can't, you will.

Andrew [33:37]: depending upon the severity of the sound a lot of the times it just even though the sound is over your mind is still so hyper focused on that sound yeah it's just echoing again and again in your head yeah and it takes a lot of faith and you're asking why is this person trying to kill me kind of thing you know or destroy me so you have to work through that as well well cool andrew i mean this is this has been great um yeah um this is going to help a lot of people and um

Adeel [34:02]: Good luck to you and your fight. Don't give up.

Andrew [34:09]: Oh, no, never will. Thanks for doing this. It's a great idea. Awesome.

Adeel [34:13]: Appreciate it. Hope you liked my conversation with Andrew. Thank you, Andrew. I really enjoyed that chat. And thank you all for listening. Make sure to subscribe to hear more stories of Misophonia next week. I'm actually bringing a conversation with a sufferer living in the Netherlands. If you'd like to be a guest, just go to and click the be a guest link. If you like what you hear and want to support the podcast, let me know by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts. That really helps raise the profile. in their algorithm and lets other people discover the podcast more easily. Of course, you can always email hello at, follow on Twitter at Misophonia Show, or on Instagram at Misophonia Podcast. The music is by Moby, and until next week, wishing you peace and quiet.

Unknown Speaker [35:15]: Thank you.