Jill - Former Miss America finalist discusses coping with family triggers.

S3 E21 - 2/24/2021
In this episode, Adeel interviews Jill, a former Miss America finalist and real estate radio show host, who shares her journey with misophonia. Jill recounts her early experiences with misophonia, which started around age 10 or 11, triggered by her mother's eating sounds and other noises. Despite not being affected by her father's noises, Jill struggled with misophonia throughout her life, including with her husband and children. Despite her challenges, Jill has found coping mechanisms like using headphones and background noise to manage her misophonia during family gatherings. She reflects on how writing an article about her condition in a local newspaper was a therapeutic experience and helped her connect with others like her. Jill emphasizes the importance of communication and therapy in managing misophonia, offering hope to others that it is possible to live a fulfilling life despite the condition.


Adeel [0:00]: Welcome to the Misophonia Podcast. This is Season 3, Episode 21. My name's Adeel Ahmad, and I have Misophonia. This week, I'm talking to Jill, a former Miss America finalist and a host of the real estate radio show Find Your Way Home with Jill. Jill reached out a while back wanting to be on the podcast and told me about an article she had written in a local newspaper in Michigan about her Misophonia. I thought this was a wonderful way of getting the word out. Local newspapers are often looking for interesting articles on stories that affect their residents, and as we all know, misophonia hits people everywhere. We talk about that. We talk about growing up with miso in the 60s and 70s, raising kids, and her message to young misophones today. Like many of our guests, she spent a lot of time early in life living with misophonia before it had any awareness. If you've booked a slot to do an interview in March, it's just around the corner and I'm super excited to start recording season four. Lots of people are writing in now wanting to be interviewed and unfortunately we'll just have to wait until a little later in the year since we're all booked now. Stay tuned for more info on that. I'm guessing that'll be early in the fall. It's very exciting to see so many people wanting to share their stories. And hey, if you're liking the shows, please do hit the stars and or leave a review, especially in Apple Podcasts, to help people find the show and their recommendations. You can always reach out by sending a message through the website, misophoniapodcast.com, or email hello at misophoniapodcast.com, or hit me up on Instagram or Facebook at Misophonia Podcast. All right, now here's my conversation with Jill. Jill, welcome to the podcast. Great to have you here. Thanks for reaching out and contacting me.

Jill [1:54]: Well, you're very welcome, Adeel. It's a pleasure to be here.

Adeel [1:58]: So, yeah, I don't know how many episodes you've heard, but my usual first kind of question is kind of roughly around where are you located in the world?

Jill [2:08]: Well, it's funny you would mention that. I just relocated to Maryland, just outside of D.C. Okay. have been a Michigander my whole entire life. And I'll actually like to think of that as our second house in Traverse City, Traverse City, Michigan.

Adeel [2:29]: Gotcha. Yeah. Okay.

Jill [2:31]: So very, very brief.

Adeel [2:33]: Just curious, what made you do that move?

Jill [2:36]: Our wonderful son, who actually works for the Pentagon in DC, he just bought a beautiful new home. And he said, hey, mom and dad, why don't you come and hang out with me for a little while? It'll work out good for everybody. And so we said, OK, we can do that. So we're enjoying it. It's a big change, the Midwestern life to this busy, busy DC area. It's working out.

Adeel [3:08]: Yeah. I was curious if misophonia makes people move around. You're saying it's a lot busier over there. Are you noticing your... Because you are a misophonic sufferer. Are you noticing any changes? Are you getting more triggered, less triggered?

Jill [3:25]: Well, that's interesting you say that because I'm not sure where this would fit in in the interview here, but my misophonia is... limited to in my household around my loved ones, sadly to say. I guess, I mean, I've heard this from people before that I may consider myself somewhat lucky to have not had any problems whatsoever in school or in general public or anything like that. But what I do have is definitely fast and furious when it comes to the people, you know, my close loved ones in the household here. It's, you know, especially as we're going into the winter months, at least it's winter here, and we're closed in more and the holidays are approaching, it has become... definitely more, let's say, stronger. But no, I don't suffer in that way, and I do feel so badly for, just since I found out about this, the millions of people that can't function in society.

Adeel [4:46]: Right. But yeah, I mean, it's not, yeah, it's definitely not uncommon that people, you know, didn't notice it in school. And it was really like, I mean, even me, for example, I've said this on the show where something, you know, it was able to get out of school, even university without really being triggered too much. But it was really in the home that was kind of the biggest problem. Since then, it's blossomed into, you know, uh other places restaurants and whatnot but uh definitely it was started and is is kind of has been mostly centered around the home interesting that you decided to um you know jump in and just kind of move in with a with your you know with your with your son uh kind of growing that yeah growing that family base but uh That's the kind of like, I guess, the dichotomy that we all face, the dilemma that we always face. It's like we have our loved ones that we want to be with, but they do end up being that trigger.

Jill [5:46]: You hit the nail on the head. So I basically went from, well, you know, I'll get into that, but I'm a mom and I have raised three, we rather, make sure I put my husband in there. We raised three wonderful sons together. And so we've been empty nesters now for how many years? So this is, it had been just dealing with this misophonia with my husband under the roof. And so now it is with my oldest son and my husband. So yeah, that, you know, it's kind of a brave step there on my part to just to be kind of adding another one in there. You know, you overcome it by the love you have for your loved ones and to manage it on different levels. And it's in many ways, I know most people will say it's one day at a time, you know.

Adeel [6:45]: Right. Yeah, a lot of us think one day at a time or any kind of period that might be triggering us like a dinner or something like that. It'll be over. People have to stop eating a meal at some point. Things end and then you can get on to fun stuff. I'm curious now, going back to, so you came from Michigan, and when you first reached out to me, you sent me a link to, I guess, an article you'd written, was it in a local newspaper out in Michigan?

Jill [7:19]: Yeah, yeah. I did that because, I mean, I really don't know how this works. I wanted you to know that I truly, I mean, why would someone do this that wasn't an actual sufferer? But I wrote an article, yes, that was published and originated in the Traverse City Record Eagle. And then I think it went into some of their, I guess for a better word, satellite places in northern Michigan. I did this mostly just for myself and my family to put everything down on paper that my feelings and how it began and how I found out about misophonia and how healing it was to find out. It is, as you people say all the time, a thing, that it is a thing, and now has a name in the medical community. So I was, I mean, do you want me to talk about that for a moment?

Adeel [8:11]: Yeah, yeah, please.

Jill [8:14]: I was at work. I want to say it's only been, now I should take from the beginning. I grew up, and like most people that suffer from this, I want to say around age 10 or 11, around the dinner table with my parents. My four siblings were all baby boomers and they were out of the house by the time I came along. So I remember realizing that these sounds coming from my mom while eating were... just for lack of a better word, horrific to my, and you can't, at 10 or 11, you're going through changes already. So that being thrown in is just, sometimes it was just unbearable. Now, the odd thing, I mean, in my mind, it's odd, it may not be odd, is that it didn't affect me with my father. my father it did not very close to my mother and you know normal relationship with my mother i would say it was you know um for a pre-teen pretty much average i love my mom love my dad but it didn't bother me with my dad but anyway so at the dinner table then it went into um other sounds my mom would make while just speaking talking sounds and um she made she had dentures most of her life so that didn't help any um and just living with this then i of course down the road breaking getting out of the house and getting married you know making your way in the world I moved to South Florida and became, I was a runner up in the Miss Florida pageant and did a lot of modeling and things where, you know, I just was coming into my own, I guess, as a young person. Met my husband and things were just really great. And then at some point, this, I call it a demon, took over and now it is hitting me with my husband in the sense of talking, eating and I would say some breathing sounds upon, you know, in sleep, breathing sounds.

Adeel [10:32]: Right.

Jill [10:33]: So I got a pair of earplugs for the sleeping part. And now all this time with my mom and my husband, no one knows. Okay. That may be a little bit different, too, that I never shared this pain.

Adeel [10:51]: No, that's not uncommon at all. It's not? Okay. Yeah.

Jill [10:54]: I mean, I've been reading and when I do some research about a lot of people lash out and say, stop doing that. I never did. It wasn't because I was too nice. I just thought that.

Adeel [11:05]: We bottle it up. Yeah.

Jill [11:09]: A monster. I mean, how in the world could this be? Who does this? Who thinks this way? You know, that was for decades in my, you know, I never said to my mom, why are you chewing that way? Why are you talking that way? Never, never, never. Just all inside, inside.

Adeel [11:27]: So then I... Did you ever give her, do you remember giving her, you know, the glare? The glare that we all talk about or any kind of... Oh, absolutely. Did she ever notice?

Jill [11:40]: You know, it's interesting you say that because our relationship... probably was strained more than I realized. And it probably, you know, you just kind of enlightened me in a way I never thought about before that it probably was because of that. Probably because I didn't give her a lot of, you know, she got hugs and kisses from me and she, you know, we, we did, went through the motions that way, but I probably didn't get close to her in a physical, emotional sense that I could have because of this misophonia. You're probably right. Yeah.

Adeel [12:17]: No, I share that, and a lot of listeners do. Yeah, there's kind of that see-through barrier, kind of a glass barrier that misophonia, I think, puts between people.

Jill [12:30]: And I'll tell you, too, this is important, and it's bringing back memories. As my mom was on her, the last, say, year of her life, she suffered from cancer. heart conditions, and then she broke her hip. And she was a strong, strong warrior her whole life. And she didn't get sick till 90, age 90. But I was one of her primary caregivers in her last year, last months, and definitely last days. And I was the one with her when she passed. I think that, I like to think it's God's grace or something that as she was you know in in the bed and what you know there's a lot of sounds coming out of someone when they're when they're so sick you know and they're dying basically i i was able to block that out isn't that amazing at that at that i'm talking about the very end it Because I needed to be there to hold her hand, to feed her, to wash her dentures and brush her hair. And at those times, that was the only time in my whole life that I remember being able to suck it up.

Adeel [13:51]: Yeah, that's interesting because I mean, but yes, similar with me, I was there kind of in the last few months of my dad was in the hospital with a lot of stuff going on and I just don't remember being triggered. It was just like the kind of a much lower priority to worry about that. Yeah.

Jill [14:08]: it's well we know you know we don't choose how we we can't choose how we react it just does so maybe there's some kind of you know just sort of grace that comes in into the system that makes you able to to uh to do what you have to do at the time but anyway so yeah i i don't think i was i know she loved me dearly but i think i was probably one of the children that was uh you know, we butted heads, and I think it was mostly due to this. So, but... Gotcha. Yeah. Well, so... I'm sorry, go ahead. I don't mean to cut you off.

Adeel [14:45]: No, no, this is a great tangent. I think we were originally talking about that, the article you wrote. Yeah, right, right. Yeah, you want to talk about it and continue with that?

Jill [14:56]: Yeah, so how I found out, so this is it. Going into the... So I talked about my mom and then my husband and then it came, okay, so I started having children and then one by one, first son, second son, third son born, the sounds and the noises of talking and mouth sounds and eating invaded the relationship with each of my children as well um again nobody knows from the get-go or or no no it has certain it's i can't say it's an exact age but it was not as it nothing is an infant or a toddler those were wonderful wonderful yeah those times i want to say probably around the year that years they start getting their grown-up teeth and they start to you know just That's the only thing my brain can process is that's probably around the time maybe eight, nine, seven, eight, nine. Maybe not, maybe even a little sooner. I didn't write it down. But the first son, then the second son, and then had a span. They were back to back born, then had a span of seven years before... my baby was born, our baby Noah, and it wasn't happening with him. Even as he grew a little older, it wasn't happening. And then it was almost like a light switch. One day it happened. I don't remember where or when, but it was like, you know, just not cusp it. Damn. You know, it was like, I thought, but this thing doesn't, it, you can't escape it. You know what I'm saying? And so now it's and my three sons. So I'm a mom and I'm, I like to raise my children the way I was raised with, you know, dinner on the table by six o'clock and well-balanced and I didn't want any of that to get in the way. So I think I went into some coping mechanisms with, you know, maybe play the radio a little louder while you're eating or, run the dryer, run the washing machine, run the dishwasher. Nobody picked up on it. They didn't know, of course. Why would they think? Then a little bit after they started leaving the house one by one, I was on a break at work and I read an article on my computer on my break. It just popped, I don't know how, I didn't search it out, but it just kind of popped up in the Google articles and it was a, word misophonia was on there, which didn't attract me. But when I saw the words, hatred of sound, I, I backtracked and it, you know, I mentioned that in my article, the words, anxiety, swallow, panic, popcorn, chewing, munching, they're just words, but they, they hit me and it hit my heart. And I read it, went back. Actually, it was an article about Kelly Ripa who, Oh yeah. is a sufferer and how she kind of was making light of it on her show where she pulled out the New York times article and said, I think I have this, but the whole article then showed her kind of snapping at her children, um, at home. And I, once I got the name misophonia, of course, then, you know, I Googled the heck out of it. And I did say in my article, like, I felt like I had won the lottery and that's the only thing I can compare it to, uh,

Adeel [18:38]: being penniless and all of a sudden winning five million dollars yeah that's funny it's yeah that's what happens is like you you find out about it then people people have told me they're they're up all night they don't sleep they're just kind of they go down that rabbit hole of like oh my gosh this explains yeah in a good way right yeah yeah yeah yeah right in a in a good way i mean well you know i already have it i already had it now now it's all

Jill [19:04]: how do you cope yeah exactly oh my god oh my god i can't wait to go home i think i went home early and i was like john and my husband's name is john i have some good news and i have some well the bad news is that everything you have basically done said and done and eaten in the last three decades has driven me crazy you know what i mean i don't remember my wording verbatim yeah yeah as well as the kids and my mom and sometimes my dad. And the good news, so his face is like, what? And the good news is I feel like a million dollars. I'm so excited. I'm so happy to know that. And that was just the beginning of we know we all research it at that point and read and read and read and read. And it has a name. It's relatively, the disorder is not new, but the name is relatively new. I am so happy that I can get through the rest of my life now because of this information. And I feel like it's hard to find the groups, but I would like to the rest of my life just educate. And anybody who wants to talk to me, I'm an open book.

Adeel [20:22]: Yeah, there's definitely... Yeah, and that's great. And I think a lot of people would benefit from that. They're going to benefit from your story here. But yeah, I mean, there's Facebook groups. And yeah, if anyone's listening and wants to reach out, we can all get connected. That's great. And what was your family's reaction when you told them? Oh, yeah, I... Because, you know, you're on your, you know, we find out about it. We do all this research. We get into this kind of like a, you know, I call it a misophonia honeymoon phase where we feel like, yeah, we're going to tackle this. But then we don't get quite the same reaction from other people because it's not a big deal for them.

Jill [21:11]: No, no. And I wrote this article. I mean, I had a lot of people say, I mean, I might have put it out on Facebook or something just to help out people. you're so brave for doing this because you feel like when you stick your neck out like that, you know that people are saying, yes, you're brave, but they also are looking at you like, what the heck? These people say, not me, the people say, I've never heard of that. Are you sure that's a thing? So I, no, I made up a name and put this out just for attention. You know what I'm saying? It's no, that if you guys could only, and maybe your really close family and friends want to talk to you at length about it. But I find that a lot of people are uncomfortable with it a little bit. Not my family, but maybe friends or, you know, distant friends that they don't talk, they don't bring it up. They just say, maybe thinking that it, would upset me, but it doesn't. It's the same as a death of somebody. You're supposed to talk to them about it and not bury it and not put it under the rug and never bring it up. However, back to your question, my three sons and my husband, extremely supportive. You know, let's talk about it. At the beginning, I remember they wanted to hear everything I had to say. Pretty surprised because I did hide it quite well, as I mentioned before. So they were, and I'm happy about that because it made me feel, I did sacrifice not lashing out, not, I shouldn't say I sacrificed, but by carrying the pain and burden all those years alone, I felt like I was glad to give them a little bit more of a normal life.

Adeel [23:13]: childhood without the crazy mom that can't be in the room with them eating you know what i mean right so you wouldn't even eat with them like you you try to think keep things as normal as possible not not kind of like shine not put a spotlight on it but just you know sneak out of the room around meal times no no we had the traditional sit down yeah dinners the the only thing is that i would

Jill [23:41]: always sit at the end of the table, and I would put, it's not funny, but even to this day, they are all seated at the other end. I wonder if they ever, I don't think anybody ever said, why are we so far from you? And I would, no one really said it, but I was just going to say, I'm at the head, dad's at the head, and you guys are sitting by dad.

Adeel [24:07]: It's like you're at a parole meeting. Oh, yeah.

Jill [24:11]: It's like, how's the food down there?

Adeel [24:13]: Yeah.

Jill [24:16]: So we just, on a lighter, fun note, too, we just went out and purchased a dining room set. And it had to be, and now we can talk about it, right? My son, who's 31 now, who we're with, kind of living with for a little while, we're... went out and purchased a dining room set. And I was like, no, we have to get this one, this model, because it has the two bigger leaves that extend it further. So now, my gosh, I'm like out in practically another room at the end of the table, but they understand, they get it. So it's, you know what I mean?

Adeel [24:59]: No, that's great. And are you guys able to, now that it's out, are you able to joke about it amongst yourselves? Because humor is a great coping mechanism if all else fails. A lot of people find if you can kind of joke about it, it kind of lowers the amount of pain that you feel.

Jill [25:22]: Absolutely. Oh gosh, I'm the I think the one that's always a little off color, the one that's you can probably tell by the interview, I'm the one cracking jokes and I'm the one. The guy thing, these they're a little more serious. My military son, my middle son works for SpaceX, which is, you know, launch.

Adeel [25:43]: Oh, nice. Yeah.

Jill [25:44]: Yeah. You know, he's serious. He's always. And then my our third son is. our kind of our sports management jock, but Mike, you know how guys are. I mean, they're a little more serious. So I'm the one that makes up the fun and the joke about what I have and they do or don't react. You know what I mean? But I think if sometimes I think if I had daughters, you know, or more, more female presence around that there would be a little more laughter, but no, you're right. You, you, you have this thing. You have to, One Christmas a few years back when it was already out there, we were sitting around watching Christmas movies and TV shows and having, it was a beautiful, the tree, you know. And everybody went, this is where I have a hard time too, as many listeners will know, when the snack time comes.

Adeel [26:38]: Oh, yeah.

Jill [26:39]: So, you know, that involves peanuts and nuts and popcorn. in that close room so i got up and said guys i can't i can't do this i'll be right back and then i came back in with my big old headphones and then it really was fine well i had a couple glasses of wine that was even helped a lot more helpful there with my headphones and we continued on and i really couldn't it really kind of buffered it out so when it i can't do that all the time but i think like i said these coping mechanisms of earplugs or head headphones or some background noise does help out a lot. Go ahead and talk, Adeel. I'm just rambling.

Adeel [27:22]: Yeah, no, no. Those are the classic ones. I was going to ask you about kind of your data coping mechanisms. So you got the 50-foot dining table. That's one. You got the headphones. So you're watching a movie, and do you just have the headphones on as like a noise blocker, or do you have going on two? Yeah, I've only done this a couple.

Jill [27:46]: Yeah, you mean, I don't know how to, I don't have the expensive pair that, whatever, what is that called where you can... The noise-canceling ones, like the Bose.

Adeel [27:55]: Yeah, noise-canceling.

Jill [27:56]: I don't have, I just have the kind you put on an airplane when you listen to the music.

Adeel [28:00]: That's all you really need, yeah. So were you listening to the movie with those headphones on, or were you just kind of reducing all noise? No, I was able to the Christmas movies.

Jill [28:18]: Yeah, I'm able that was I was able to I do that because I if they let me turn the sound up.

Adeel [28:26]: Oh, gotcha.

Jill [28:26]: Loud enough. I can hear. And I don't do this all the time. I don't do this all the time. This is just a couple of times, but it's when you, it's those special times where they know you have it and you don't want to be out of the room. It's family time. Everyone flies in for Christmas or something.

Adeel [28:45]: Exactly. It's, you got the tree, like you said, yeah, it's like a kind of a beautiful moment. You don't want to just, yeah, it's, there's that dilemma. It's like, ah, you got to deal with some misophonia, but then it's like a magic moment. So, um,

Jill [28:58]: Yeah, and if you don't mind me looking... Hey, I'll tell you, wine is... I don't want to go down that road, but a glass of wine takes the edge off. A little relaxing at night, not driving or anything like that. So yeah, those are all coping mechanisms. Speaking about it now, I just had that thought back when I was a kid. My dad would yell at us if we chewed celery. when we were all growing up. And so I think he had a touch of this as well. I think it's hereditary. I'm not sure. Do you know if this is hereditary or not?

Adeel [29:37]: Jury's out on that. Yeah. But it's funny. You're not the only one who's mentioned that or even had put that connection just on the podcast. It's like, oh, you know what? One of my parents, you know, my mom or dad, they used to react to stuff like that. Classic, classic mechanisms. Yeah. Wine is just one more. One second on that. Yeah. Wine seems to. Yeah, a good amount, like a reasonable amount. It seems to calm things down, but you don't want to have like too much of whiskey or something, which turns to me.

Jill [30:08]: Oh no, not promoting hardly.

Adeel [30:12]: They all have their different effects I've found. So anyways, I just want to put that out there in case anyone was considering this for like a, you know, occasional cupping mechanism.

Jill [30:21]: Yeah, that's just my personal thing and not advocating that at all. No, be better off for headphones or You know those little earplugs they sell in the store are foam?

Adeel [30:35]: Oh, yeah.

Jill [30:36]: And they're beige. And then, you know, you don't see those, especially if your hair is down at all.

Adeel [30:43]: Yeah, that's interesting. Some earplugs have done well, but I feel like, I don't know, maybe I have like super sensitive hearing, but it's just like it can, I don't know, I guess I can still get triggered. It's just like a lower volume. I feel like me personally, I need some sound over it to mask it. But I guess everyone's got their own, but that is definitely a common mechanism.

Jill [31:06]: It takes off a layer. It just takes off the edge. I think if you would call it that, it just takes off the edge. Like the other day, we were driving in the car, and my son and husband said to me, let's get something to eat. Well, you know, now with the pandemic, we're picking up food mostly. So I said, well, I won't be able to get through sitting in the car.

Adeel [31:33]: Oh, eating in the car. Oh, God. Yeah.

Jill [31:35]: Yeah. Because you're all right. Right. We're right next to each other. However, if you guys if we can leave the car on running and blast the music.

Adeel [31:45]: Yeah.

Jill [31:46]: And yeah, you said it a deal. I put the radio on. I think I'll be fine. And I was because remember, we're eating at the same time. So we're making our own sounds in our head. They're automatically kind of blocking out other people's sounds by our own eating and chewing.

Adeel [32:04]: Do you use mimicry as a, I don't know if you've heard of that as a coping mechanism, but some people have mentioned that where if they hear a trigger, they try to copy that trigger at the same time. And it seems to help some people. No, I don't.

Jill [32:20]: I read that. I did read that. No, the only mimicry would just be, it would be good that if I was eating, if you're eating, kind of thing.

Adeel [32:31]: Right, right.

Jill [32:33]: yeah so yeah it's kind of a it doesn't work for me but it seems to seems to work for some people um did you have i know you're doing the interview but do you have um you had mentioned earlier before we started recording i was clicking a pen um you know a lot of people are triggered by other sounds mine just seem to be oral but do you have that are you suffer in that way

Adeel [33:00]: Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think I definitely have the yeah, the chewing and the oral. But but yeah, there's there's definitely other sounds, especially I guess if they're going to be repetitive in nature, like like a pen clicking could be if you know, if somebody is going to keep doing that. that that could definitely yeah that could definitely be a trigger too so it's not yeah for me it's not just um you know ear uh mouth out the nose but the mouth nose and throat but that's definitely where it started and that's kind of number one number one grouping for me sure um sure definitely not the only one and like a lot of people they've kind of grown over time it seems like for you it's been fairly static in terms of it's that the the mouth sound area

Jill [33:46]: yeah and and then this is also amazing other than yeah it never went into sounds pens or Other people, no other people in the public have I ever had a problem with. I mean, I could sit in a movie theater next to 5 million people chewing popcorn, doesn't bother me. I don't understand. I guess I'm reading why the brain is wired, why it is with your loved ones. I'm not 100% sure why. My sister, very close with my sister, and she'll be like, oh, I'm sorry, I'm eating on the phone. I shouldn't because I know you have that thing. And it doesn't affect me at all with my siblings. Yeah, so that's why, I mean, I have it bad with my family. So I kind of like to have myself some more answers as to why I'm able to. be totally one thousand percent normal around public my sister my siblings and even my father yeah who who is the one that hated people chewing salary when we were you know younger But why does it pick on why my mother, why my husband, why my sons?

Adeel [35:05]: Yeah, that's odd that it hit just kind of one person from the previous generation and then just everybody from your current generation. Yeah, that's really interesting. Do you have visual triggers as well? I know a lot of people... especially with people whose triggers are around the mouth sounds, they have a hard time watching people eat or even bringing their hands near their faces or just kind of anything in that category. Do you notice that as well?

Jill [35:39]: I actually do, and again, it's limited to my husband and my sons. It's not... as bad as the actual sounds, of course, but I've started noticing that the last couple of years. You're almost anticipating what it could be like as soon as they go to do something. You're freezing up. You know, your body and your brain is tensed up in that split second, and I think that's what you're referring to, right?

Adeel [36:16]: exactly yeah it's almost like a pavlovian connection that uh it's like you know you've probably been triggered a lot by the sounds and then then what's you know what's what's a constant thing around that sound is like the the visual and then suddenly the visual is now triggering you uh is kind of my theory and probably probably maybe a working theory no i it's i think it you're right i i haven't really even thought about it like that but it's true it's

Jill [36:47]: If my eyes were closed, I probably wouldn't have the trigger hit me until I actually heard the sounds. But you're right, it's just prior to. You know what I'm saying? So it is on what you're looking at as well. It's interesting that you would have brought that up because I never considered myself getting triggered by visual. But I think it's all... you know, centered around food in the visual. So I guess we should throw, besides your earplugs, the blinders on at dinner time. That'd be hard to get your food in there.

Adeel [37:26]: Well, you just have to keep your face right above the food so you can look down and see the cake. We could come out with an entire line. Yeah, we can come out with an entire line of Miss Funny products, a fashion line. That no one else would understand. Oh my gosh. But yeah, maybe, so what was, so you told your family, but obviously the article that you wrote probably reached a lot of people. I'm curious, like, did you start to get feedback from the community?

Jill [37:58]: I did. I received a few letters. Mostly it was online, you know, responses from people that were saying some of it was right, you know, publicly, maybe on Facebook, but a lot of private emails and messages on Messenger, people saying, really thank you for writing this, had no idea. My son has it, my nephew, my sister's best friend, whatever the case may be. And they passed it along to them. And some of them, you know, reached back out to me and said they were getting help or it was just a huge relief to know this existed so i think that um that's where the gratification comes in you know if i have to have this and if i've had this and it's you know invaded my life on so many levels um for so many years i'm going to try my darndest to to make someone else feel as good as i did when i read the you know initial article because And I feel in some way, if anybody's listening, I feel a little helpless. I just have reached out to people, but there's so much more I'd like to do. I just don't know where to apply myself.

Adeel [39:19]: Yeah, well, if people are listening, you might have some ideas.

Jill [39:22]: If they're listening, I hope they are. One other thing is the youth. I wanted to tell some of the younger people, maybe young girls that are suffering with this, that I suffered with it in tremendous ways, but I was able to still, what I consider, have a quote-unquote normal life, went into the Miss America pageant, scholarship pageant arena and do something, you know, had what I consider a normal life and exceed and married a wonderful man, had been able to give birth and raise three spectacular, loving, humble, successful sons. So there is a light at the end of the tunnel. It doesn't mean, you know, because so many people are, I've heard maybe thinking of suicide or just thinking that my life is going to be in shambles because of this, but it doesn't. And I want people to know that, that I didn't have therapy, but now there's, you know, there's therapy for this. So if it can happen to me, it can happen to anybody.

Adeel [40:44]: Yeah, no, I'm glad you said that. And that's, that's something that does come up. We, we definitely have some conversations about some, uh, you know, really, uh, dark, dark moments that some people have and have a lot of high schoolers that come on and are really worried about what's going to happen, but, um, have equal number of people like yourself come on and say that it does get better. And, uh, and people are able to do amazing things and like like you raise you know raise amazing and amazing next generation um and and that's that's really a testament to kind of i think how strong we are and uh um and that's great and i think we have more control over our environment like you get to you got to

Jill [41:22]: you know you got to specify your dining table as a kid yeah there's a lot of you know we just have to live with whatever our you know surroundings give us but you have a little bit more control yeah yeah and and another point to make to a deal is that i i always tell them it's not you it's me remember that well they know that it's not them but i think it's important to to re to You know you need the support and the love and the understanding, but it's also important to remind them, please don't change. I shouldn't say that because you do want people to help you out there, but don't be on eggshells. That's the last thing I want because let me do the coping. This is my thing. Let me figure this out. You guys try to be courteous and all that at the same time. Do you know what I mean? Like you sit there and eat your nuts in front of the TV and I'll figure this out. because I want them to know they didn't do anything wrong.

Adeel [42:27]: Yeah, no, I totally, I totally know what you mean. And that's, that's, I've heard that as well. It just, if they, if, if they're kind of, if it seems like they're kind of like going out of their way to get eggshells, that kind of adds to the stress that we feel. The number one catalyst I feel. And so either, either basically make a joke about it or do it without me knowing, like, like, like try to, you know,

Jill [42:51]: try to try to whatever you're doing to kind of like hide the uh sand or whatever you know i think we'd all like to either not know or you know make a joke about it and lighten the mood um this is kind of the i think the best things people can do absolutely you don't want to easier said than done but you're trying not to to make them also uncomfortable because uh like this coming christmas we have a one of our sons flying in and No, I don't want them to feel uncomfortable in any way. And they know, and this is the beauty part. They know now. So mom can go get her headphones or mom can, you know, that's why she's sitting at the far end of the table and maybe the radio's playing. it's good that it's out there, I guess. Yeah.

Adeel [43:43]: No, you're right. And it's, yeah, it's not just, uh, it's not just to hide things to kind of reduce stress on us. We, you know, we're, we're, despite what we feel that sounds, we are relatively reasonable people. We don't want people to be uncomfortable just because of our, our issue.

Jill [43:59]: Exactly.

Adeel [44:00]: But is there anything I want to, um, you want to kind of leave people with as we start to wrap up here?

Jill [44:08]: Well, um, Just in summary, there is a proverbial light at the end of the tunnel. If you're a young person listening to this, you're a young person suffering with this, hang in there because you can leave a full... beautiful life. You can do whatever you want to do. This does not, this is where I want to say, identify you. This is not what makes you you. It's just something that some people have, you know, diabetes. Some people have, everybody's got something, you know, and this is a cross that we have to bear. But there's a lot of things to look forward to in life. A lot of great milestones and just hang in there and get some therapy and talk to people. That's the main thing, communication.

Adeel [45:10]: Yeah, knowing that there are other people around that you can, you know, contact at kind of a drop of a hat is just a great thing to have in your back pocket because you can just think about other people. If I'm going through a trigger and I think about, oh, I just talked to Jill or somebody else about something similar, that just kind of puts me at ease. And I think that's a big part of, yeah, being able to communicate with people is to help them and help yourself.

Jill [45:33]: Yeah, right.

Adeel [45:35]: Because now it's, yeah, sorry, go on.

Jill [45:38]: No, I was just going to say this has been so therapeutic for me because, as you said, I don't talk to people. I'm the one that is trying to educate, and I live with this. But even talking to you, Adeel, I feel so much better you sharing some of the things you've shared with me on your interview.

Adeel [45:58]: Yeah, that's great. That's great. Yeah. That's a big part of doing this. Honestly, this, this was actually inspired by the last in-person convention that I went to where Menino spoke and a bunch of other people spoke. It was just like these, these kinds of like hallway conversations or conversations at the bar where I feel like the most valuable parts of it. So the more of this we can do the better and, and thank you for, for, yeah, for, for reaching out kind of out of nowhere and coming, coming on the show.

Jill [46:26]: Yeah. No, my pleasure. I think I saw you put little snippets on, I think it's on my newsfeed on Facebook because I am in some of the phonia groups, but I don't know how I got thing. I'm not sure how that.

Adeel [46:38]: Yeah. I'm in those groups too. So I usually every, every, every Wednesday when a new episode comes out, I just kind of like, you know, spam all those spam on the groups with little video snippets. And yeah, I'm glad that you're glad that you found it.

Jill [46:52]: And thank you for doing everything you do because this helps so many people. It really does.

Adeel [46:58]: Thank you, Jill. And thanks again for that article. I hope that inspires others to write. The link is in the show notes. If you're enjoying the shows, don't forget to leave that little review. Give us a follow on Instagram or Facebook at Misophonia Podcast or Twitter at Misophonia Show. Music is by Moby. And until next week, wishing you peace and quiet.

Unknown Speaker [47:35]: Thank you.